Bandit Alley
GENERAL MOTORCYCLE FORUMS => GENERAL MOTORCYCLE => Topic started by: Vidrazor on November 03, 2006, 12:32:29 PM
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Anybody seen this? It's hilariously covered on Motor Cyclist as an "All Made In The USA" bike:
http://www.fischer1.com/
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What’s amazing is, it’s not like they are offering this thing at a bargain compared to major brands. It used to be when a place like Corea offered its first car it was an incredible bargain compared to the big name competitors, now they want top dollar and figure with all the interest in motorcycles by inexperienced baby boomers, they might fish them in, hence the name Fisher.
:gagme:
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Personally, I don't think it's a horrible concept, it's just that whole "All Made In The USA" stupidity. Also, what's up with fork manufacturing, anyway? What is it about forks that they have to be imported from Korea, or otherwise, for the likes of this, and Harleys?
Why can't a bike be machined from the ground-up here? Fischer gives you an option to have a German front end for megabucks more, why not a well-made American front end? Is machining in that miserable a state in the US?
I certainly don't have any beef with imported technology, but it's kind of sad that you can't have a product that's truly made in this country when it tries to portray itself as such.
I think this bike will have good potential if an aftermarket develops for it.
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Why can't a bike be machined from the ground-up here? Fischer gives you an option to have a German front end for megabucks more, why not a well-made American front end? Is machining in that miserable a state in the US?
If all of us were willing to pay the cost of labor for U.S. labor, everthing we buy would be made in America.
But as long as we demand the highest price for our labor, and the lowest price for our products, this is what we end up with. :duh:
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Well, my point is if they give you the option to spend the bucks for a German piece, why not an American one? Do you really think a German part is gonna be cheaper?
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My opinion: Just the fact that they use a play on words like assembled in the USA to connect mentally with made in the USA concept means that they are targeting ignorant people, and have no respect for informed intelligent customers because they are not targeting informed intelligent customers but rather naive and inexperienced people. The same people who buy there dirt bikes and quads at auto parts outlet stores. The only thing missing in there advertisement that would offer a bigger clue is the words “There’s a sucker born every minute”.
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My auto parts store Chinese copy of a Honda XR70 with a 49cc motor works just fine. It did have a couple of little quality quirks - like a cross-threaded spark plug and the spark module came unplugged while one of the grandkids was riding it, causing it to fry, but the $20 price for a new one was much cheaper than the price for a $79 Honda unit was OK. I'm still in it for less than 1/3 the price of a Honda.
Here in France, the Chinese & Korean scooter market is booming. You see tons more of them than you do of the Japanese or European branded scooters. And here, they run in the 900-1000 Euro price range. With 14-18 year olds only being able to pilot <50cc machines (can't drive cars or bigger cycles until they're 18), little 2-wheelers are very popular. what's almost as popular as <50cc scooters is <50cc Supermotos. KTM & Derbi seem to be the most popular.
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Under specs its listed with a 650 V twin, so I'm guessing their using a Suzuki motor?
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Don't ya just love that Cameltoe seat?. Yuk!!
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Under specs its listed with a 650 V twin, so I'm guessing their using a Suzuki motor?
Actually they use the Hyosung engine. I've seen ads from a couple of new companies using the engine. I can't remeber the brand but I believe it was "US" too. I think it's great to have bikes on the market that are competative in spec, but cheaper in price. IMHO, Hyosung, Fischer, and these other new brands would be a great idea, for 1K to 3K (in the case of the Fischer) less. I mean, come one, you have to upgrade to get good brakes on an $8K bike? THAT'S A 6XX CC TWIN! WTF? I like the idea of being able to buy a Chinese 200cc sportbike for (what I've seen) about $1500 or less. It's great for the sport an encorages starting out on a bike that can easily be handled by a Newbie. If I was starting out and didn't know how to wrench (or didn't want to) but was unsure of how much I was going to like the sport it would be perfect! Or a little cheap 30 mile commuter. It's seems that today, even used bike prices are steadily creaping up. I think for certain people and certain situations it's good to offer a viable alternative so people don't get priced out of the market.
But I digress, if Hyosung (only about $500 less than an SV650S) and Fischer keep trying to get top dollor for what is essentially a second rate product (no offense but quality controll is still not as good as the big four) then they are defeating the whole purpose.
Getting off soap box.
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I've read one bit about the Hyosung motorcycle. The only thing that I recall that they didn't like was the transmission. They said that it was like a box of rocks. The Hyosung doesn't impress me as a bike. Yea, it's has a flashy paint job, but it still looks cheap. I can see if it is significantly cheaper, but I don't think it is.
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I had a Hyosung 650 quoted at $5100, and I was told by someone you can haggle for under 5k, so compared to the SV650 it is a significant price difference. There appears to be some problems like notchy gearboxes as stated and backfiring which appears to be a by-product of meeting emmision standards, and which apparently is an easy fix.
So they are cheaper but need work, thye're not "out of the box" bikes like the Japanese models are. I suppose if you have the tools and wherewithal to hack one, it's probably a good deal.
In the Motor Cyclist article, the Fischer also suffered from backfiring, apparently for the same reasons. There were a few other criticisms, like the left-side peg hitting the ground on some turns and such. If the bike was 5- or 6k it probably wouldn't be a bad option, but as it is a Hyosung itself would be a better deal under the right circumstances.
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Well you have a good point it seems some of those off road specials have gotten pretty cheap as I saw a 200cc quad at Track Auto for $1000, and at that cheap a price one can afford a bad imitation that barely does the job with all the constant repairs. But who wants to spend all that time saving up 2/3 of the price or finance $5000 for something that you know is made up of sub standard material and engineering. You might as well look hard for an old well kept machine made by one of the competent 4 manufacturers. I would rather have a used SV650 that I know will out last and our perform a new Fisher 650. Fisher needs to stick to doing what it does best making hand held stereos and kids toys.
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What’s amazing is, it’s not like they are offering this thing at a bargain compared to major brands.
My first thought, too. An off-brand bike at full-price. Sure, getting a hand-built peice of art like a Confederate is an off-brand bike, but you buy ti to have something really special. Calling this oddball an "exotic" is just covering up for the fact that it's overpriced.
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Ok, I am not American, so I can laugh at this one....
Right from the sales Brochure...
Exotic styling meets American quality.........
So now I am wondering, why is it that most American's drive Toyota's?
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Toyotas are "Made in America" too. :monkeymoon:
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Ok, I am not American, so I can laugh at this one....
So now I am wondering, why is it that most American's drive Toyota's?
First, it's not a car, it's a bike. However, insert H-D joke here if you wish.
Uh, what are those brands of Canadian cars and bikes again?
I drive a Honda.
How about those ads for the Suzuki XL-7 that imply it's just like riding a motorcycle? Even hot MC chicks will try to pick you up when you drive it!
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I only glanced at the article on the Fisher, but I don't have a problem with someone trying to do something different. At least he's not soaking the taxpayers for some start up money like those guys did in Minnesota trying to ressurect Excelisor I think it was. I've never understood trying to resurrect these old brands that have been gone for so long nobody really has any attachment to them except maybe a few very seasoned citizens. i'm old enought to qualify for an AARP card and I haven't met to many people who had Indians or any of these other brands no longer with us. It's neat to see them occasionally at a show but that's about it.
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Anybody seen this? It's hilariously covered on Motor Cyclist as an "All Made In The USA" bike:
http://www.fischer1.com/
Yeah, it looks mean, nasty, and fast, even sitting still, but it also looks like that pulled back tank shape and seat position is gonna be punching you in the ribcage when reaching for the handlebars, or hard front braking. Heimlich maneuver anyone? :crybaby: I don't know, maybe it's the angle of the photo, but it just looks very uncomfortable to me.
2005 B1200S
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Ok, I am not American, so I can laugh at this one....
So now I am wondering, why is it that most American's drive Toyota's?
First, it's not a car, it's a bike. However, insert H-D joke here if you wish.
Uh, what are those brands of Canadian cars and bikes again?
I drive a Honda.
How about those ads for the Suzuki XL-7 that imply it's just like riding a motorcycle? Even hot MC chicks will try to pick you up when you drive it!
When talking about the auto industry in Canada, one has to remember that there are 29 vehicles manufactured here.
Here's a list, in alphabetical order, of all the models being produced in Canada: Acura CSX, Acura MDX, Buick Allure, Chevrolet Equinox, Chevrolet Impala, Chevrolet Monte Carlo, Chevrolet Silverado, Chrysler 300/300C, Chrysler Pacifica, Chrysler Town & Country, Dodge Charger, Dodge Grand Caravan, Dodge Magnum, Ford Crown Victoria, Ford Edge, Ford Freestar, GMC Sierra, Honda Civic coupe, Honda Civic sedan, Honda Pilot, Honda Ridgeline, Lexus RX 350, Lincoln MKX, Mercury Grand Marquis, Pontiac Grand Prix, Pontiac Torrent, Suzuki XL-7, Toyota Matrix and Toyota Corolla.
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not to say they are all bad but?! i have a chevy made in Canada and it is junk. so does that mean all chevy cars are junk? does it mean all products made in canada are junk? i hope not. and just to let you folks know suzuki use to get there motors for the sv from korea. when the patend ran out they started producing them for themselves. suzuki used there own gear box, but the motor was subcontracted on the earlier sv unit before they revamped them a few years back.
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When talking about the auto industry in Canada, one has to remember that there are 29 vehicles manufactured here.
Here's a list, in alphabetical order, of all the models being produced in Canada: Acura CSX, Acura MDX, Buick Allure, Chevrolet Equinox, Chevrolet Impala, Chevrolet Monte Carlo, Chevrolet Silverado, Chrysler 300/300C, Chrysler Pacifica, Chrysler Town & Country, Dodge Charger, Dodge Grand Caravan, Dodge Magnum, Ford Crown Victoria, Ford Edge, Ford Freestar, GMC Sierra, Honda Civic coupe, Honda Civic sedan, Honda Pilot, Honda Ridgeline, Lexus RX 350, Lincoln MKX, Mercury Grand Marquis, Pontiac Grand Prix, Pontiac Torrent, Suzuki XL-7, Toyota Matrix and Toyota Corolla.
Dangerously drifting off topic here, but...
You first made the point that a Japanese brand was the bestselling marque in the US. No dispute there. But not one of the vehicles you mention is a Canadian brand. That's no different than the various Japanese brands that are assembled in US locations...point being, if you wanna gig US buyers for not buying US brands (and again, I have a riceburner bike and a riceburner car), you can't really claim anyone in Canada is doing any better at supporting the home economy.
BTW, I find it interesting how one article will claim that the reliability difference between US brands and foreign brands has become almost negligible, but then the next article will claim the ost reliable cars are mostly Japanese. The head swims...
CNN's coverage of Consumer Reports most reliable cars (CU is by sub only): http://money.cnn.com/popups/2006/autos/reliable/index.html
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Uh, what are those brands of Canadian cars and bikes again?
they where called bricklands... and i miss them
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>>they where called bricklands...<<
Bricklins, actually, and unfortunately they were about as Canadian as the Fischer is American:
http://bricklin.org/BI_HistoryOfBricklin.htm
Great-looking cars, tho.
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>>they where called bricklands...<<
Bricklins, actually, and unfortunately they were about as Canadian as the Fischer is American:
http://bricklin.org/BI_HistoryOfBricklin.htm
Great-looking cars, tho.
Are you trying to say that because he was an American inventor that the cars he produced in Canada (with the Canadian goverment as the primary financial backer) aren't Canadian??? LOL. By that logic Fischer is as AMERICAN as baseball and apple pie!
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I guess you didn't understand my statement. My reference was that many of the components were imported from another country, in this case the US, just like many of the components of the Fischer come from Korea and/or Germany.
That's why I said the "they were about as Canadian as the Fischer is American." It wasn't meant to be a negative slant on the car, or anything like that.
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Well, this train's off the tracks...
I don't know about the Fischer or the Hyosung. I don't think I'd buy one, yet at least. I'd rather buy a Japanese bike that I know will work, and will last a long time. The Korean brands will probably get better, but someone else can suffer through the growing pains with them, thank you very much.
As for this Canada vs. US crap, the two countries are so closely intertwined in so many ways that other than very minor basically regional differences, they're really the same damn thing. Americans are really just Canadians in a hurry. And Toyota is the number one selling car brand in the US, Canadians prefer the Honda Civic. Both like Ford and GM trucks more than Japanese trucks. And the Bricklin was a pile regardless of where it was built.
Now excuse me, I have to go jump in my Ontario built Ford F-150, gas it up at a US owned gas station(unless I stop at the Dutch one), go to Wal-Mart and Canadian Tire, eat at, I dunno, Quizno's or Mickey D's, and maybe pick up some stuff for one of the three Hondas, one Suzuki and a KTM for good measure. And maybe stop at Safeway for some groceries.
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Well, this train's off the tracks...
I don't know about the Fischer or the Hyosung. I don't think I'd buy one, yet at least. I'd rather buy a Japanese bike that I know will work, and will last a long time. The Korean brands will probably get better, but someone else can suffer through the growing pains with them, thank you very much.
As for this Canada vs. US crap, the two countries are so closely intertwined in so many ways that other than very minor basically regional differences, they're really the same damn thing. Americans are really just Canadians in a hurry. And Toyota is the number one selling car brand in the US, Canadians prefer the Honda Civic. Both like Ford and GM trucks more than Japanese trucks. And the Bricklin was a pile regardless of where it was built.
Now excuse me, I have to go jump in my Ontario built Ford F-150, gas it up at a US owned gas station(unless I stop at the Dutch one), go to Wal-Mart and Canadian Tire, eat at, I dunno, Quizno's or Mickey D's, and maybe pick up some stuff for one of the three Hondas, one Suzuki and a KTM for good measure. And maybe stop at Safeway for some groceries.
:congrats:
Oh, and by the way, I own a Chevy, Pontiac & Ford.
I stay the hell away from Wall mart though, they are evil!
Canadian tire is selling a Chinese line of ATV's & off road bikes here, and let's just say you get what you pay for from what I have seen.
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Apple pie is american??? WTF!
:duh:
Do i have to pay extra taxes if i'm eating one that hasn't been made in the USA? :monkeymoon:
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Canadian tire is selling a Chinese line of ATV's & off road bikes here, and let's just say you get what you pay for from what I have seen.
Yeah, I've seen those things in St. Albert as well. They're Chinese built, with cheap Honda clone engines. The bikes look like they'd fall apart loading them in the truck, and what's with the rake? Chopper flop in the dirt would be bad. No way I'd put my kid on one.
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Cycle world drove the bike to jay lenos garage, Jay was not impressed...., at all. Cheap looking bike, $5999.
I have bought the chinese honda 70 copy, a small kid cant break it but its really built cheap, clutch and brakes wear in a 10th of the time the honda lasts.
I think thats good for the person trying to save some money and the kid isnt a hard rider yet, and you wont be keeping the bike long.
But a 650 street bike, at not much of a savings (unlike the 70 which is on sale for $299). Im not paying 6 large for a bike I KNOW isnt the build quality of a honda. But it cant hurt the market that the Koreans are trying??