Bandit Alley
MODEL SPECIFIC => SUZUKI BANDIT 250 & 400 => Topic started by: VW_NUT on November 22, 2007, 11:56:05 AM
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Hi everyone,
I figured I'd post pictures here in case any one is interested. Thanks for all the information on this site. I have found info for all the usual problems on this site.
Any a little history on the bike. It was a bike my girlfriend bought to learn to ride on. We bought it off a local guy who didn't have the time/energy to get it running. It appears it hasn't run since 1997. It was cheap, but needs alot of love. 1st order of business is to get the rusty tank fixed, and make the bike run.
Some pics.
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/PA060008.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/PA060014.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/PA060013.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/PA060012.jpg)
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After cleaning the tank out and using the KBS coatings rust blast, we realized there was much less tank left than I first thought. Check out the pics. I was able to weld it with my MIG welder, but it wasn't pretty. Pics of the damage, unfortunatly I haven't taken pictures of the functional but ugly fix.
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/PA120018.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/PA120024.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/PA120022.jpg)
I was able to fill in the holes, and will finish up with the tank sealer soon.
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My girlfriend wanted to paint the bike white, and painted all the fairings in a semigloss white. We decided to use spray cans incase the bike tips over so touch ups will be easy and inexpensive. Thank you to Lowes Racing for providing the Rustolieum spray cans.
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/PA270034.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/PA270036.jpg)
Also on the agenda was a carb cleaning to try and fix the rough running
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/PA270039.jpg)
As it turns out the reason it ran so rough was plugs 3 & 4 had the wires switched...
Also found a slip on on ebay. Anyone know what brand this might be?
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/PA270032.jpg)
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More projects to follow including painting the header black again, a fork rebuild and shock upgrade...
Anyone have any tips on what to do for fork springs. My girlfriend weights 110 with gear... Will the stock springs be ok, or should I upgrade? I want to use a bandit 1200 rear shock, however, I will probably have to make some dog bones to keep the bike low for her.
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Cool project!
Is that a Cobra exhaust? Kerker????
For the rear shock, the 2G B12 shock doesn't raise the rear TOO much. IIRC, the 1G shock will raise it more.
Good luck!
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Cobra F1 pipe. Man i just have to say that tank is a prime example Suzuki metal, Now after seeing that tank all you can imagine what carb nightmares you will have with out a fuel filter. :beers: Keep it up
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:beers: Thanks guys... Do you guys install inline fuel filters as a precaution for the carbs? My girlfriend is 5' even so I may have to make dog bones for any shock that raises the bike. Thats ok though, I just want something that feels better than the shock thats on there. Right now it feels like one of those cheap full suspension bikes at wal-mart.
More to come, although the progress has been slowed by the cold weather in Maine...
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One of the first photoshops I did when I got mine was white tank/fender/plastics with the red frame/swingarm! Looking forward to the progress.
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:beers: Thanks guys... Do you guys install inline fuel filters as a precaution for the carbs? ...
yes sir :beers:
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Thanks... On my way to the garage to do some work to the tank.. I wish 400 tanks weren't so hard to find.. I've got a few saturdays in this one...
Also, you guys recomend any particular suspension set ups for a 110lb rider (with gear)? I have to change a fork seal anyways, so if I can make some changes while I am in there... I am also looking into finding a compatable rear shock on ebay, unfortunately all of them seem to be longer..
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I'm 130 and I have no problems with the stock spring. Unless the suspension is shot, I'd try the stocker first.
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For the rear shock, the 2G B12 shock doesn't raise the rear TOO much. IIRC, the 1G shock will raise it more.
Good luck!
Actually, the 1G B12 shock is shorter, so it would raise it less than the 2G... maybe even no raise at all.
Do you recall how much the 2G B12 shock raised your B4?
FWIW, a 2G B12 shock on a 1G will raise a 1G's tail ~1".
(This doesn't mean a 1" lift at the rider's perch, but 1" at the tail light.)
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I don't think I ever measured it. It was noticable but not radical.
Here (http://forums.banditalley.net/index.php?topic=524.0) is a good thread on it from the FAQ...
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Thanks for the info guys! I checked race tech's web page and the stock springs are .57kg/mm, and the lightest springs they offer are .80kg/mm, which will probably be stiffer than she needs. Maybe I'll just try a rebuild with stock springs. Is it possible to shim the stock springs for more preload?
On the project forum, we finished coating the tank with the kbs tank sealer. It took a while to get it to dry. We had to keep turning it to avoid pooling which took forever. Hopefully its all sealed up now.. More pics soon.....
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Hey all,
I suppose I shoud introduce myself- I'm VW-NUT's better, er uh I mean other half :wink:
I'm happy to report that the tank sealing is finally done. Now I can move on to the fun bits like reshaping the welds on the visible part of the tank and painting. I am really looking forward to getting the tank painted so I can see how the color scheme I've dreamed up is going to look.
Since VW has posted the extremely abbreviated version of this project, I thought I would post a link to the complete project summary. It's on a Ducati forum, but you should still be able to view it as a guest if you so desire.
http://www.ducatimonster.org/smf/index.php?topic=95269.0
We will definitely be adding to this thread as there's still a lot of work to be done to the old girl.
Cheeers,
Meagan
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How are the spring rates on rear shocks from either a bandit 1200, or hayabusa?
Reason I ask, is I figured the average rider is probably 180-200 and what is ideal for you might not be for my gf..
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How are the spring rates on rear shocks from either a bandit 1200, or hayabusa?
Reason I ask, is I figured the average rider is probably 180-200 and what is ideal for you might not be for my gf..
The Busa is 13.1 kg/mm and they figure the avg rider to be 165 lbs... according to the Racetech site. I don't know what the spring rates are for the 1G or 2G B12's and Racetech doesn't have the info for them either (nor the B4's rear shock for that matter). I do know the 'Busa's spring is much stiffer than the 2G S model's spring (naked 2G's have a stiffer spring than the S model).
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So you are saying we'd be better off with a shock from a bandit 1200 than a busa.
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Given a light weight rider, yes.
Not only is th Busa shock stiffer than the B12, it is also longer than the 2G shock, which is longer than the 1G shock, so if you're trying to keep a low seat height without messing with the geometry of the B4's progressive linkage, there's another strike against the Busa piece... despite it being a higher quality unit.
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Thanks :beers: If I were to make a slighly longer dog bone to lower the bike 1" or so, would it screw up the linkage? I plan to drop the forks the same amount to keep things equal. Thanks again guys for all the helpful info.
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In addition to lowering it, the longer dog bones give more leverage against the shock, which gives the effect of a softer unit in all regards.
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On another topic related to your restoration... I read the posts over on the Monster board (nice write up, BTW!). I saw that you had to replace some missing o-rings when you put in the jet kit. If you didn't already, I would HIGHLY recommend replacing them all the next time you're in there. If you do any reading here, you'll see that they can make you bang your head against a wall. I'd replace them all before you start any serious tuning.
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Hey guys, just wanted to let you know I've posted some updates in the other project thread. (Figured it was easier to link to it instead of playing the copy/paste game).
Here's the link again:
http://www.ducatimonster.org/smf/index.php?topic=95269.0
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The bike runs as of this weekend. Sounds and feels pretty good although I may have to use Tomac GTI's write up to change the valve seals. It is a little smokey after you rev it up when the rev's come down & the motor had been sitting a while. We will see after it is run some more.
Also, I cut the header just after the collector to install the slip-on muffler. What is up with the collector on the factory header?? There are like 3 pipes in there. One is pretty small maybe 1.5" or 1.75". It took some work, but I smahed out the smaller one with an air chisel to open up the stock collector. Is this a common mod to the stock collector?
Next project is to sand/prime/paint the tank.
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I'm on the DML as well. I ride with a bunch of the DeVal guys and I use the same screen name.
The smaller pipe inside of the header collector is a silencer. DO NOT cut the divider in the center of the collector, it acts as the 2-1 portion of the pipe and helps the bottom end. If you do cut it out, the tubes aren't optimised to run 4-1 and it will run like crap and be a total bitch to tune (think drag bike). Everything will be on the super-high end and will not be happy in the midrange.
The only difference I can tell from modding the collector was more noise. I changed too many things at the same time to relate differences. Getting silencer out of the collector out was a bitch because there's a weld that joins it in there layered up with some perf'd pipe as well. I didn't have an air chisel so I had to do it the old fashioned way. The inside portion I cut out with my Dremel and smoothed the weld with a drum sanding bit. I figured I just made myself a poor man's header.
Also, since you have your muffler apart, repack it. The F1R from Cobra was notoriously deafening. Doing the collector mod isn't going to help matters any.
To make sure it is indeed your valve stem seals, remove the header from the head. Take a look inside the exhaust ports and look at the stems themselves. If they look like a kid's nose in the winter (all runny and such) they're toast. You can also look down the spark plug holes at the piston top. If it's oil soaked, there's your problem. It isn't unusual for a motor to smoke a bit when it's fired up after awhile especially after doing some work to it. It will be very apparant leaving stoplights though as it was full-on Spyhunter for me since the seals were so shot.
Best of luck.
-Randy
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So since the collector has already been hacked up, now what?
I guess the lesson here is to ask before instead of after...
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i said before but way back in the day there was a guy that raced a bandit and modded the collector in the header and did a write up about it that post is so long gone and he also had some dyno charts with some other info. I only remember fragments of it but wish i would have saved it any one remember his name? Also there is a link floating around of a total motor rebuild write up in japan or some where that is about a bandit 400 some peeps have seen it lots of pics and detail about tearing apart a bandit 4 motor would be nice if some one posted that again id like to save it for future reference.
cheers
Jay
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I wish I knew that that header mod post existed. I wonder if it can be found somehow.
Motor rebuild link from Japan:
http://translate.google.com/translate?sourceid=navclient&hl=en&u=http%3a%2f%2fwww1%2eodn%2ene%2ejp%2f%7ecde33290%2fFeelingOver%2fTechnicalWorks%2fBandit400Racer%2dEngOH%2ehtm (http://translate.google.com/translate?sourceid=navclient&hl=en&u=http%3a%2f%2fwww1%2eodn%2ene%2ejp%2f%7ecde33290%2fFeelingOver%2fTechnicalWorks%2fBandit400Racer%2dEngOH%2ehtm)
Alright, so you super-hacked your collector, not all is lost. Here's what I would do before damning it all to hell (which I do often, btw). Just to make sure, we are talking about the flat-ish piece of steel in the collector just after the merge of pipes right? If you didn't do anything to that, I'd say you're OK, disregard all of my blabber.
-Run it and see if you can deal with it. You will have to re-jet but you can see if you can live with it.
-If you have access to a welder, cut an access port with a cutting disc into the side of the collector and try to replicate the divider. All it is, is a piece of flat steel shaped just so. It floats somewhat after the pipes enter the collector. You should see the vestigial remains from where it was before since it's welded in. I would cut it open on the side facing the motor so you'll never be able to tell. Don't cut into the pipe that your exhaust clamps onto but the collector itself. A little black paint and you'll never be the worse for wear.
-Get another header, stock or otherwise.
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just so we are clear, I did not remove the separator, but only the restrictor silencer & smoothed out the area.. Thanks for all the info! This place is a great resource for these bikes.. :beers:
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thats the best link needs re wrote tho
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So, there's been quite a lapse in time since the last update and now, but I have a bunch of new pics to share for those who are interested.
Enjoy!
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5020002.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5020004.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5020005.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5020006.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5020007.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5020008.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5020009.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5020011.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5060012.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5060013.jpg)
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(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5060014.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5060015.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5060016.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5090017.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5090018.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5090019.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5090020.jpg)
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(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5090021.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5090022.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5090023.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5090024.jpg)
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Laying out the details of my tail chop and blinker locations:
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5120025.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5120026.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5120027.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5120030.jpg)
Test fitting the mini-spear signals (the bike actually came with the wiring harness hidden away within the headlight assembly):
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5120028.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5120029.jpg)
I swapped the handlebars over tonight. You can see there's just a wee difference between the two:
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5120031.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5120032.jpg)
Getting ready to apply the decals. You can also see that the rear wheel has been set back on and the foot pegs have been painted black, along with the triples, headlight housing, brackets, and some other tidbits:
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5120033.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5120035.jpg)
Decals - I love them and hate them all at the same time. They're fun to do but lining them up can be a PITA. After applying the first side, I took some measurements and used fine line tape to mark off the area I needed to land in on the other side.
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5120036.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5120037.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5120038.jpg)
And the moment of truth:
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5120039.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5120040.jpg)
Yippee!
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(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5160041.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5160042.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5160043.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5160044.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5160045.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5160047.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5170048.jpg)
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(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5170049.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5170050.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5170055.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5170056.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5170057.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5170051.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5170052.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5170053.jpg)
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w50/Rockhopper15/P5170054.jpg)
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Beautiful :thumb: :motorsmile:
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man that looks really well
and you did all that spraying with rattle cans? looks like a really good finish!! I was thinking about doing something like that myself, mainly the wheels and clock housings i really want to change the colour of but might give the panels a go too as they are rough
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Looks great - and really cool project!
I hate the paint on my CBR (also a careful rattle-can job). I wish I had done something like that with the white with red and black accents. Did you/are you doing clearcoat over it?
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repaint the cbr then, we expect a pic thread soon :bandit: :bandit:
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repaint the cbr then, we expect a pic thread soon :bandit: :bandit:
No way! Doing it well is a lot of work! Unless I decide to toss it down the track at some point (or off the trailer again which is what led to it's current scheme!), it's staying as is!
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Oh, and for anyone looking for a cheap stainless steel brake line upgrade, the crossover line that goes over the front wheel from a ducati 749/999 works perfectly if you notch the caliper a little. I found 2 on ebay for $25 shipped. I can post pics if anyone is interested.
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PLEASE PLEASE renew the pic links!!!! :motorsmile: :congrats:
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I will remind Hangin_Biposto to update the links. The bike is running strong. These 400s are so much fun. :thumb:
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Tell me about it!
I have a 93' V devil! I really dig white colour in bikes and i just can't stop thinking spraying it pearl white with black mat frame like yours .(i think GSXR k9 has this colour combination)
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Hello mate!!!
What about these pictures?? :beers: :beers: