Bandit Alley
MODEL SPECIFIC => SUZUKI BANDIT 250 & 400 => Topic started by: BrianM on May 14, 2007, 09:41:56 PM
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And the B4 was a bit of a surprise. More flickable that I'd thought (by a smidge) and Very well composed when I was dragging the exhaust... damn mid-corner bumps. It Definatally needs a longer shock (my Fox started at 12", I've added just about another 1/2" and it needs more) to take full advantage of the rubber and handling. Though I'm glad that I haven't gotten TOO rusty in the 7 years since I was last on the track. Didn't push much though as I'd ridden 400 miles down to the track and had to rely on the bike to get home the following day. Plus, a 'Stich just doesn't offer the same confidence as a set of well-fitting leathers. The Avon Azarro's (a sport touring tire) had no issues with being run to the edge, even with the rear at 46psi hot.. :grin: (they need high pressure, don't shed heat well and get greasy at Street speeds when you go much into the 30's). I can't wait to get some cartridges into the forks and head back down there. Next time with the bike on a trailer and leathers in the trunk so I can push a bit more. A simple 1 mile go-kart track with 11 corners.. 2nd gear the whole time (could have blipped into 3rd at points, but I wasn't looking for absolute fast, just fun in the corners).
Sure wish I had a closer track, and am enving those of you who do. For the rest who haven't gotten the B4 onto a track, make the effort so you can Really see what the bike is capable of doing.
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I'm getting a 1-piece suit made so I can do just that. (I'm too tall and thin for off-the-shelf suits)
Last track day I did I was wearing my cordura gear and it got pretty munted when I fell off, so I want some leathers which will last a bit longer.
I haven't had any issues with the exhaust scraping since I changed to a gsxr1100 shock, but it did scrape when I first got the bike on the original shock. I haven't got it over far enough now to see if the pegs scrape before the tyres let go... I've got some cheap Avon commuting tyres, the rear says RoadRider.
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The exhaust scraping is solved by getting a stiffer front fork. If it's solved by raising the rear, it's raised way too much :wink:
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Yup, front forks are stock outside of the oil and fork seals (as best as I can tell) and they show it. They really Aren't all that bad for damper rod forks, the damping is pretty good and matched well to the spring rate. Just way to soft for me at 260lbs, and I already have a plan for upgrading. Just shopping for a price I find acceptable.
I didn't have issues anywhere but the one corner, when there suspension was loaded AND there was a nasty mid-corner bump (expansion crack that went the whole way across the track surface).
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Well, there's one more advantage of having stiff suspension. The exhaust will then function as a, say 'crash-catcher', same goes for the jiffy mount on the left. Like today, I lost grip in a wet left corner, it hit the jiffy mount and came right back :motorsmile:
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The exhaust scraping is solved by getting a stiffer front fork. If it's solved by raising the rear, it's raised way too much :wink:
I've changed the springs and increased the preload in the front as well, but I'm pretty sure it was mostly the rear shock that stopped the exhaust from scraping. The gsxr shock is slightly longer and also has enough preload available that the laden sag can be set to 30% on the rear, with the standard shock it was about 60% iirc.
Surely it'd only be raised too much if the suspension started binding or the chain got too loose. Even with it raised like it is, and the forks dropped slightly in the tripple clamps, I think the steering isn't as neutral as it could be.
I don't know why you say it's raised too much.
I didn't have issues anywhere but the one corner, when there suspension was loaded AND there was a nasty mid-corner bump (expansion crack that went the whole way across the track surface).
To be honest, the only place I had the exhaust bottom out was on a corner with a bump in the middle as well... ;)
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To be honest, the only place I had the exhaust bottom out was on a corner with a bump in the middle as well... ;)
Maybe lean the bike some more, you'll hit it on even pavement as well. Or do you lean next to the bike extremely? That might explain as well.
When I ran my '02 GSXR shock it was raised too much, although the exhaust scraping got less, the front fork felt more elastic too. Now it's raised because of the shorter swingarm with a stock length shock. I'm thinking of raising the bike again and see how it turns out now, with the USD fork.
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I'm getting a 1-piece suit made so I can do just that. (I'm too tall and thin for off-the-shelf suits)
Who's making your suit? You coming to Taupo in November?
I've never had a problem with the stock supension setup, and I'm not small. I'm either just lucky enough to have it more or less set up right for me, or I'm riding like a nana.
Having said that - Does anyone get right over onto the edge of the tyres? I've worn the chicken strips down to 3-4mm, but I'm not quite over on the very edge. Scraped the pegs a couple of times last track day, but.
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Having said that - Does anyone get right over onto the edge of the tyres? I've worn the chicken strips down to 3-4mm, but I'm not quite over on the very edge. Scraped the pegs a couple of times last track day, but.
Absolutly.... never touched a peg doing it either. There's still a bit of useable front tire, which will be resolved by leghtening the rear ride height (raising the tail) and I may drop the front a Touch too... though I vastly prefer going up in the back over going down in the front.
Dragging pegs while leaving some of the rear (especially, that's easy to run out to the edge) could be to 2 different issues with stock suspension. Either you're getting so close to bottom that you're dragging stuff before using up the rear, or you just plain don't have the confidence to toss it into the corner because the suspension doesn't allow the confidence (i.e. riding like a nana :P )
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Which tires are you running? For instance, a BT45 x-ply tire doesn't require a big lean angle to get rounded. Radial tires are usually much pointier. Most of the time I have Pilot Power, 2CT front at the moment and a normal rear one as the 2CT 160/60 is in backorder, so that's my personal 'standard'. They are rather pointy, but nothing compared to SuperCorsa, those require, lets say 55+ degrees to get rounded :shock:
I've posted a pic of my last, worn out, tire set somewhere (http://forums.banditalley.net/viewtopic.php?t=8653&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=70)
Front is round, and then some :lol: The rear stays behind, this was a 150/60, the 160/60 on a 4.5 inch rim I have now looks like it's wearing better. Can't tell yet, it's brand new and it's not too warm outside lately.
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Having said that - Does anyone get right over onto the edge of the tyres? I've worn the chicken strips down to 3-4mm, but I'm not quite over on the very edge. Scraped the pegs a couple of times last track day, but.
I get to the edge of my tires. I have the front end lowered 12mm. The front end is an old GSXR fully adjustable.
But I would still like to get the back end of the bike up a little more than my Fox shock will allow so I'm having shorter dog bones made. Shorter by 10mm. I will see how that make the bike handle.
It handles very well now but I still drag a peg on some corners and my toe sliders are taking a beating.
G
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can anyone tell me how long the dog bones arte i have a bunch lying around may be able to help someone out
cheers
Jay
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Stock bones: 198.5mm eye-to-eye
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opps! all i have is 138mm
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I get to the edge of my tires.
When I had your old track tires on -- I had more then one person say "You must ride the hell out of that thing..." wanna de-chicken my new tires???
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I get to the edge of my tires.
When I had your old track tires on -- I had more then one person say "You must ride the hell out of that thing..." wanna de-chicken my new tires???
I think you should get your ass out to the track and de-chicken them on your own. :stickpoke: :grin:
Sign up for the Fast school. Beware . . . the track becomes very addictive. :grin:
G
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I think you should get your ass out to the track and de-chicken them on your own. :stickpoke: :grin:
Sign up for the Fast school. Beware... the track becomes very addictive.
Maybe in a few years... I gotta wait until funds allow for a second bike, trailer, truck and leathers... okay maybe next decade... or two.
For now I'll have to go hit some on ramps and try not to get any tickets.
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Maybe in a few years... I gotta wait until funds allow for a second bike, trailer, truck and leathers... okay maybe next decade... or two.
For now I'll have to go hit some on ramps and try not to get any tickets.
Why? I rode my B4 (only bike) 400 miles down to Denver, CO to visit with some friends. We hit the track (me in my touring suit, an Aerostich) and had tons of fun.
Just because you're going to the track, does *NOT* mean you Have to push 10/10ths or even 9/10ths. I rode at a solid 8/10s (with the exception of the first time I scraped the exhaust and lost traction, that was a 10/10ths), ran the tire right out to the edge and started gumming it up a touch. Never even got out of 2nd gear.
Unless you're going Racing, you don't need all that stuff you mentioned.
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I agree, first many times I went to the track it was on my street bike. You only have to push as hard as you want. What I always thought was funny, and not picking on you, but was people that say they can't do a track day because its their street bike, but yet they ride super aggressive on the street where its much much more dangerous to ride 6/10ths, than it is to ride 9/10ths on the track. If your a decent rider you can ride faster than you've ever ridden and have a good time, on the track, and still not be anywhere near in danger of crashing.
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These guys are correct. I just bought an old beat up van to load my bike in and it takes all my gear and I can sleep in it.
I'm on a low budget for my race team of one. It doesn't have to cost you an arm and a leg to get out there an turn some laps and have some fun learning.
I look forward to seeing out there sometime.
G
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I'll look into it. I was pretty sure around here you needed full leathers to hit the track and that alone is out of my budget right now.
Last year I was looking into the fast school. I figured going and renting a bike would be easier then prepping my street bike for the track. But then again I thought track officals were nazi's about stuff like glass, coolant and belly pans... I might be wrong.
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I'll look into it. I was pretty sure around here you needed full leathers to hit the track and that alone is out of my budget right now.
Last year I was looking into the fast school. I figured going and renting a bike would be easier then prepping my street bike for the track. But then again I thought track officals were nazi's about stuff like glass, coolant and belly pans... I might be wrong.
For most track days
All lights taped up (best to pull the fuse also so tape doesn't bake on) and mirrors off.
Side stand tied up on some tracks.
Oil drain plug wired.
No coolant. Water and water wetter only
Tires must be in good shape.
Leathers have to be at least two piece with a full zipper.
That should get you on the track at a track day in the
beginner group.
You can buy used leathers pretty cheap if you look around.
The whole thing takes some effort to get into and can be a little daunting at first but it soon gets to be run of the mill stuff.
G
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Last year I was looking into the fast school. I figured going and renting a bike would be easier then prepping my street bike for the track. But then again I thought track officals were nazi's about stuff like glass, coolant and belly pans... I might be wrong.
All depends on the track and organizer. The last track day I went to had no real requirements (my oil drain is safety-wired, but I'm running a 40:60 glycol:water mix for coolant, left the mirrors on and headlight untaped), it was more or less a "Police your own" type place and seemed to be working Very well. There were no run-down bikes there, most people were running their street bikes that they rode to the track and all was good. They did have a requirement of a 1-piece riding suit, but it didn't have to be leathers.
Then I've been to some track days that were as strict in requirements as normal roadracing. Actually, MORE strict for the A and B groups (racers and fast guys) in they required an expert race license to get into the A group, and a roadrace license to get into the B group.
But just call the organizer and see what their requirements are. A large number of the guys down here in the States have a limited number of leathers for rent, and will assist with prepping the bike at the track the morning of the event. Heck, I've volunteered to help some newbies prep their bikes at the track before and will probably do it again if I ever get close to a real track again.
Anyway, don't discount being able to afford the track till you do the homework.
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Yeah - the only thing I really did to track my B4 was tape the lights, remove mirrors and take off the plate. That's acceptable for the entry level of most of the orgs I know of. If you have something capable of pulling a trailer, you can rent a little 4x6 from Uhaul for like $25/day here in the US.
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Hi my name is Jay :bigok: and im here today because :stickpoke: im addicted to racing :shock: or for that matter just riding on a real track :clap: the aroma of the fuel :lol: the smell of the shredding rubber :congrats: . To me there is nothing more safe than being on a track racing or doing track days :duh: . there is always plenty of people to make you feel at home :motorsmile: and a ambulance near by :wink: , you never have to worry about if Elie fustacoo :roll: in Amish country will see out in his field that the cows seem to keep licking something :stop: and there is a smoldering pile of something out yonder :sad: . Corner workers and control riders do there jobs 99.9% of the time to its fullest. doing a track day will make you or anyone a better rider. :congrats:
Have a good job if your going to race or you can be part time like me old arse lol.
AMA wera grand national at mid Ohio sports car course is where im heading in august.