Bandit Alley
MODEL SPECIFIC => SUZUKI BANDIT 250 & 400 => Topic started by: gsxr400 racer on January 03, 2006, 12:55:31 PM
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http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SUZUKI-GSF-400-BANDIT-EXHAUST-KERKER_W0QQitemZ8026428872QQcategoryZ10534QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
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That's ugly... :monkeymoon: sorry :beers:
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bet it makes power tho !
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how bout this one
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Bandit-400-Exhaust-Vance-and-Hines-GSF400_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ35596QQitemZ4601647466QQrdZ1
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That one makes the Kerker look beautiful!
(I didn't think it looked THAT bad... afterall, it is off a 16 year old bike.)
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I have the same V&H setup on mine (my version looks a little nicer)...man is that sucker loud (too loud). I even got the quieter baffles for it, no luck. Seems to flow great though, as my B4 is much quicker than my FZR400.
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i had only the can from the kerker on my bike. it was to loud. so now i am driving my b4 with a sebring power jet can.
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Try riding without a can :banana: Don't forget to make an extra bracket near the foot peg :bigok:
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Try riding without a can :banana:
That's what the MotoGP guys do.
I like what little hearing I have left too much to ride with an open system - or even a loud one. I've already sacrificed some hearing to my younger, wilder days with loud 2-strokes, rock concerts and being too lazy to use earplugs on the flight line.
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who one the vance and hines?
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:banana:
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oh shit ! great deal bro :beers: OH and nice big foot truck!
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oh shit ! great deal bro :beers: OH and nice big foot truck!
Yeah - it looks like crap but for $30.... I couldn't pass it up. The pipes aren't any worse than the ones on my bike when I got it. They cleaned up pretty nice. I've contacted V&H about a new sleeve and badge. We'll see. I'd love to make my M4 work but I'm guessing the inlet is too small.
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OH and nice big foot truck!
Uh... my ebay addiction is getting out of control!!!! :shock:
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We can get new can sleeves for these things?
Well sheeet... gotta get ahold of Yoshimura then!
Congrats on the exhaust, Rob. Hopefully your wife lets you keep this one! :beers:
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We can get new can sleeves for these things?
Well sheeet... gotta get ahold of Yoshimura then!
Congrats on the exhaust, Rob. Hopefully your wife lets you keep this one! :beers:
I know that D&D, M4 and I assume most manufacturers have sleeves. You just drill out the rivets, pull off the old one and rerivet the new one on.
Todd - it was the wife's 'rents, who live next door, that had a problem with the D&D. Maybe they'll like V&H better???? :shock:
I may take the mid-pipe and my M4 can to an exhaust shop and say, "Make these fit!!!". I really like the look and sound of the M4.
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Todd - it was the wife's 'rents, who live next door, that had a problem with the D&D. Maybe they'll like V&H better???? :shock:
Ah, I thought it was the wife. I'm not sure if the wife's parents bitching is better or not, though. :monkeymoon:
I may take the mid-pipe and my M4 can to an exhaust shop and say, "Make these fit!!!". I really like the look and sound of the M4.
Yeah, I may do the same with my Supertrapp if I can't get the Yosh a new skin, or if I just don't like the sound of the Yosh. Looking at the two cans, I suspect they flow the same.
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Looks like I can get a new inlet and core of the correct size (comes as one piece) for my M4 for $130. Not cheap but considering what I paid for the pipe, I might do it. It's still cheaper than a new can and I really like the M4. I still need to call V&H to see how much the sleeve and badge will be.
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:shock:
It's here! And it's as hammered as it looks. The inlet is only 2 1/8in. I think a exhaust shop might be able to work with me to make the 2" M4 work. Anyone have any thoughts on that?
Just what I needed - another project! Thanks, Jay! :monkeymoon:
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Rob, take your new-to-me exhaust to a muffler shop and either:
-Have them expand the V&H header out to slide over the can
-Expand the end of the can out
In any case, you would have to bring both anyway. It would just make life a ton easier than trying to do it with a ruler.
I don't think I would recommend the latter unless you trust the guys since that thing is made of unobtanium. Their tubing machine will make it look obsurdly easy versus using the poop boys special tailpipe expander. In my experience those things work if you have impact and oxy/actylene to heat the pipe first.
I picked up Chris's stock setup and was contemplating doing a high-pipe like yours but may end up just repacking the Cobra. I was hoping the headers weren't "clearanced" like mine are (read: squished a bit) but for the smoking deal of $5, I'm not one to complain.
-Randy
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I was hoping the headers weren't "clearanced" like mine are (read: squished a bit)
Still not as bad as the '78 oldsmobile tornado. The olds 403 had one header that that was 3/4 restricted in order to fit the oil filter with the fwd crap. :shock:
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Thanks, Randy.
Any idea what negative effect reducing 2 1/8" down 2" will make. Will it significantly negate the advantages of having a full system?
I need to take everything apart and see what I can make work (while still looking reasonably good). The M4 is 18" and the V&H can is only ~14" so it won't be as easy as I had hoped. Maybe reuse my current mid-pipe and retain my high-mount set-up? I don't know...
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Just what I needed - another project! Thanks, Jay! :monkeymoon:
May I request that you work on your dual headlight setup first? :lol:
Russ
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Have the 2" part expanded to 2 1/8" - any muffler shop should be able to do this for you in a few seconds.
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Any idea what negative effect reducing 2 1/8" down 2" will make. Will it significantly negate the advantages of having a full system?
In my experience it's easier to go up than down (at the muffler shop anyway). Do the pipes even slide in on themselves or is it a sloppy fit? Another thought would be to go to Poop Boys and see if they have a stepdown adapter. That's a common one they would carry. You should have enough clamps etc leftover to make it workable without looking too cobbled together. Also make sure to use some copper RTV on the joint for reassembly. It will seal as well as make it easier to take apart down the road if need be.
If anything, the step down sometimes creates a compression vortex that re-speeds the air through gaining some velocity. Extra bonus is that it can quiet an exhaust as well. Also, at that point, I don't think it will matter so much since the end of the system is right there. If you ever look through a Summit or a Jegs catalg, they have inserts that you place either before the muffler or after the tailpipe for just such a reason.
-Randy
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Have the 2" part expanded to 2 1/8" - any muffler shop should be able to do this for you in a few seconds.
Right but it's gonna reduce somewhere. If I expand the inlet of the can, it'll reduce in the core and the outlet. If I expand my current midpipe at the collector, they'll only expand it for a few inches and it'll reduce to 2" from there up. Or am I being a moron (again)?
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I'm getting a little confused here.
At what location(s) do you have a conflict of sizes?
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Expand the can if you want to run the V&H system. It will be the most minimal BS. If you think about it, it's perf'd anyway, it's not like it matters, honestly.
If you go high-mount, your midpipe will be a very, very slight restriction. I think you will notice more gain from the better headers than you would a slightly smaller inner diameter.
Honestly Rob, I think it's a wash either way. If it were me: I would keep the high-pipe (clearance and cool factor) use the V&H header (lighter than factory Bandit anyway) and continue to use the M4 car (sounds wicked and it's light).
Sound reasonable?
-Randy
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Jesus apples oranges , oranges apples get it done mate! Wish my life was so simple! :beers:
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I'm getting a little confused here.
At what location(s) do you have a conflict of sizes?
What??? I'm clearer than Jay, right????
Randy has it right. I think my options are using the V&H headers with my 2" high midpipe (stretched to fit the header outlet) or the V&H mid with the M4 stretched. The problem with the latter is that it's gonna be too long. Once I play with it a little - do some dry-fitting, there may be other options... like having a muffler shop make me a new 2.25 mid bent like my high pipe... Like I said, another project. :roll:
Yeah Russ, I'll get to that head light!
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:grin:
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Jesus apples oranges , oranges apples get it done mate! Wish my life was so simple! :beers:
Yeah - I'm a regular F-ing fruit salad with this thing! :motorsmile:
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I'm getting a little confused here.
At what location(s) do you have a conflict of sizes?
What??? I'm clearer than Jay, right????
Randy has it right. I think my options are using the V&H headers with my 2" high midpipe (stretched to fit the header outlet) or the V&H mid with the M4 stretched. The problem with the latter is that it's gonna be too long. Once I play with it a little - do some dry-fitting, there may be other options... like having a muffler shop make me a new 2.25 mid bent like my high pipe... Like I said, another project. :roll:
Yeah Russ, I'll get to that head light!
OK, I see now. I didn't realize you thinking of different setups, so I couldn't understand why you'd need to stretch the mid and the can. Now I see it's an either/or thing.
Can the V&H mid be shortened?
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Can the V&H mid be shortened?
It has a bend at both ends and one of them would have to be recreated from the cut end but I guess that could work.
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Ok, last stupid question and I will let this thread mercifully die!
If I were to use my current, high-mount, 2" mid, would I be ruining the power gains from the headers? Obviously, I'll loose something. Just wondering how much. (To correct my post above, it's narrowing from 2.125 to 2)
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Just a SWAG, but with a 400, I'd say you probably wouldn't notice any difference. The smaller diameter may even help lower rpm punch.
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Correct. That public hair of difference that far back in the exhaust isn't going to matter a fart's worth of gas.
Just to give you some background: my 16v Rabbit with motorwork and is completely tuned, runs a 2 1/4" exhaust. Best guesstimate is around 140hp at the crank, stock being 123hp. This car is 1800cc. A Bandit is 400cc and comes stock with a 50mm exhaust...
For reference sake, the factory VW exhaust on these cars originally was 50mm (with the 1.8l 8v motor). These cars weren't slow in 1984 either.
I think you'll be just fine Rob.
-Randy
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Thanks, guys. If the end of the new header is close enough to the same place as my current, I'll give that a shot.
I was cleaning up those pipes last night. Quite a mess! :shock:
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The last chapter (mercifully):
I dry fitted everything today. I'm going to get a new tube made for a mid. The new header sticks back enough that I need about 1.5" more clearance at the swingarm. I'm going to get it bent just like my current highmount pipe in 2" so I can use the M4. That way I can switch over to the V&H mid and can for the track if I want and permanantly if I ever find a deal on a new can.
I can't wait to see the difference with just the headers. Man, peering into the stock collector, there's all kinds of tubing restricting flow in there. There's nuthin' in the V&H. :banana:
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Hey rob when you switch over to the V&H header there is a very good chance you will have to rejet as well!! I had to when I went from my stock head pipe and cobra slipon to my Yoshimura.
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Correct. That public hair of difference that far back in the exhaust isn't going to matter a fart's worth of gas.
Just to give you some background: my 16v Rabbit with motorwork and is completely tuned, runs a 2 1/4" exhaust. Best guesstimate is around 140hp at the crank, stock being 123hp. This car is 1800cc. A Bandit is 400cc and comes stock with a 50mm exhaust...
For reference sake, the factory VW exhaust on these cars originally was 50mm (with the 1.8l 8v motor). These cars weren't slow in 1984 either.
I think you'll be just fine Rob.
-Randy
Well sorry to stomp all over your theories but the Bandit makes about 150 Hp per liter, so if we bump it up to 1.8 L it would make 270 Hp.
To make this kind of power an engine needs air flow, both in to OUT.
So please don't compare a bandit to a vw again! :thanks: LOL
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Hey rob when you switch over to the V&H header there is a very good chance you will have to rejet as well!! I had to when I went from my stock head pipe and cobra slipon to my Yoshimura.
Yeah - I figured that. I bumped my main 2 sizes as a starting point. Thanks, Chris.
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Whatever, I made a point for comparison not a pissing contest. My experience is building car motors (VW obviously) that make power and are reliable. I'm learning about motorcycle stuff but it all is really the same: air in, air out.
I love riding my bike but I realize that it's 15 years old and starting to get very scarce (and difficult) to find parts for. It certainly doesn't make 150hp/L and I can't drive it in the snow either. I'm not going to try to turn it into a GSXR because by the time I invest that level of time, research and money into it, I could have very well just gone out and bought something twice as fast and powerful that someone's already done the hard work for.
Best of luck on your project Rob, that last one left a bad taste in my mouth.
-Randy
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Im still new to the whole motorcycle thing and know very little about what exhaust is good and which are not so good. I have learned what everyone on the bored prefers but has anyone every run an ART Titanium slip on? Theres one on Ebay right now, new, for fairly cheep. Is it worth it and am I going to have to rejet no matter what exhaust I do end up choosing? Does anyone have suggestions for what works best with the least amount of trouble. I should also mention that this would be going on a stock 91 B-4 and that I would just being hacking off the existing can.
page with ART slip on below
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4605933839&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT
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It looks like that would work. A 2" inlet is right for sure. You'd need a clamp and a way to hang it. It's a nice lookin' can. They sound good on SVs. I'm sure it would improve the note of an I4, too. I'm sure someone will correct me here if I'm wrong but I doubt just swapping the can would REQUIRE rejetting.
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Thanks Rob
Any suggestions on where to get the clamps? I found some at denniskirk.com for about $62 but I know they dont have an exact match for the bike should I just stop by the local shop and see if I can pick up the clamp and some kind of hanger to make it fit?
thanks again
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The last chapter (mercifully):
I dry fitted everything today. I'm going to get a new tube made for a mid. The new header sticks back enough that I need about 1.5" more clearance at the swingarm. I'm going to get it bent just like my current highmount pipe in 2" so I can use the M4. That way I can switch over to the V&H mid and can for the track if I want and permanantly if I ever find a deal on a new can.
I can't wait to see the difference with just the headers. Man, peering into the stock collector, there's all kinds of tubing restricting flow in there. There's nuthin' in the V&H. :banana:
Any updates on this project? Was the M4 transplant successful? I have the same Vance & Loud system and may be looking for a less obnoxious can.
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Thanks Rob
Any suggestions on where to get the clamps? I found some at denniskirk.com for about $62 but I know they dont have an exact match for the bike should I just stop by the local shop and see if I can pick up the clamp and some kind of hanger to make it fit?
thanks again
Dammit - I didn't see this post before. Sorry. That ebay item has been removed so I don't know what you ended up doing. If it were me, I'd go to ART's website and see if they offer parts like that. They probably do. I know that M4 does.
As for an update... so far so good. After a few trips to the exhaust shop, I have it all painted and the M4 bolted on using a custom 2" mid. I actually fired it up yesterday for the first time since November. I couldn't run it for long b/c I have no coolant in it and had a leaky carb for some reason. It sounds mean. The M4 with the V&H headers sounds much deeper and nastier than what I remember it sounding like with the stock headers. I think it's gonna be pretty loud. If I get a chance, I'll bolt on the full V&H one of these days to see what difference it makes.
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Full V&H SuperSport is LOUD.
I have it on my bike, with new quietech baffles...doesn't make a diff.
One good thing is that you can't sneak up on anyone in traffic :shock:
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No worries
Ebay ended the auction for some reason and I bought the holeshot can from zeebandit so its all good.
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where are you guys getting these v&h headers from and what model? is it a B4 specific model? thank you
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yes sir its for a b4 specific. mainly from ebay. I will tell you guys what, the pipe on my gixxer 400 is a factory suzuki thin wall stainless race header verey rare to find , verey light . But here is the kicker a buddy on mine and a member of this board, is having reproductions of them made. they will fit your b4 but you would have to sorce a oil pan and a sump for either a gsxr 400 model gk73 or gk 76 and then you could run this pipe should be fairly cheap to get a oil pan and sump from the UK. Id say around $30.00 to post ! This to me would be your best bet for a great pipe! look for posts by stripes1976 or something like that!
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Yeah - mine is from the original post in this thread. It was from a guy that wadded his B4 track bike.