Bandit Alley
MODEL SPECIFIC => SUZUKI BANDIT 250 & 400 => Topic started by: Garyola on June 22, 2009, 03:15:36 PM
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. . . . to getting on the track. I know, I know, it's very late in the season already. But my life has gotten in the way of my racing. With a little help from Jay and some hard work and way too much $$$, the 89' GSXR400R race project is getting closer.
The motor is out of my B4 racer until I can get the GSXR motor worked on ( it's in bits and I may have to wait until next winter). This should be track ready by next week. It needs a bird cage, coils, the frame sliders put on and tune up. It's going on the dyno this week for a tuneup, if all goes according to plan. I could use a race tail section and paint job but that may have to wait until I get this thing sorted.
G
(http://users.xplornet.com/~garyola/1gsxr400-09.jpg)
(http://users.xplornet.com/~garyola/3gsxr400-09.jpg)
(http://users.xplornet.com/~garyola/4gsxr400-09.jpg)
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Man, that looks awesome. Makes me want to go out and find one to build up. I'll bet that thing is gonna be a BLAST. :clap:
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Wow Gary, where did that thing come from?
I've always wanted one since I got the Bandit just for the frame and swinger. Like what the Bandit should have been in the first place: factory streetfighter.
Nice, looking forward to seeing what you do with it?
Wanna sell your Bandit rearsets???
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It was in a garage for a few years just getting banged up(see the marks on the fairing). It was someone who knew someone kinda thing. Bought the bike in January and stripped it down to the frame. All new bearings in the chassis and anything that doesn't make it run and roll was taken off. I have a couple of boxes of stuff that is going for sale or in the bin. Carbs, dual exhaust etc, etc.
I will check into the rear sets for the B4 but I think I've used most of the stuff for these controls. Give me some time and I'll list what I have for sale.
G
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Hi gary,
Looks very nice. :clap: Have you compared the two bikes seeing as the B4 you raced was almost the same bar for the frame, is the gsxr much of an improvement? I raced a 73 when they first came over to the Uk but could never get a proper race faring back then. While the motors apart it could be worth converting to the gk76 shim style valve adjustment, its a bit lighter and only uses one valve spring, could help give a little extra.
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Hi Chris
I haven't had time to compare much yet because it has turned a wheel in anger. I'm hoping to get on the track in the next few weeks and I will let you know. From the riding position and measurements I find the bike to be smaller than the B4, the reach closer. there is more ground clearance than the B4 and the pegs are higher on the frame. Oh and the whole thing is much lighter.
I will considerer the valve adjustment conversion over next winter. Thanks for that info. I think I will be spending a lot of time on the heads. When it's ready to go for next April, I would like it to be a monster 400.
I should have this thing ready for a race or two in July and a few trackdays.
G
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By monster 400, are you talking a larger than 400cc bike or just a high power 400cc?
Just curious.
Bike looks great!
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I'm looking for hi-power. :grin:
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76 head works but then you have third motor mount so the 73's motor would be hanging in the two rear bolts seems to much stress... and the 76 has issues which require better springs and stainless valves do to float at high revs. Bigger carbs bigger valves better springs and milled to what it can take or get a bigger piston kit.
Gary the fuel valve has to go or you will starve for fuel...sorry
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Hi Jay,
Ment 73 head with 76 parts. You think they got a problem with float at the top end? have you found the 73 better on your race bike. Im just building a motor to go in a bandit for the track at the mo and have gone that way, you think 73 better as ive got B4,73 and 76 motors to work from. The 76 is simpler and thats how i like to keep it on the track but all roads are worth a look.
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Gary the fuel valve has to go or you will starve for fuel...sorry
What are you sorry for? :stickpoke:
Ok it's gone. I have my pringle.
G
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Chris, 76 head parts do not fit on a 73 or b4 the valve stems on a 76 are like the size of #2 pencil lead in thickness the cams are wider so they dont fit. I bought a motor once had it shipped for the same purpose to find out i could use the motor innards minus head. I had shipped over a boat anchor when it was said and done.
Right on G
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:clap:
Looks like fun. I love your race projects!
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Jay i know the feeling! we always find out after the money,s been spent, the 76A head would make a good flower pot :duh:
Keep us up to date with the motor Gary as any work is relavent to the B4.
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Hi Gary, Hope the Gixer is going well, is the rear wheel an SV with straight spokes? if so are the standard spacers and 73A caliper a straight fit as ive just picked up another SP braced swinger for my track B4 and am thinking of going this way.
JAY, Carnt find the post but remember you saying that no .4mm oversize pistons were available in the USA, spoke to my local Suzi dealer and they say the numbers are listed as available at £74 + 15% vat for the piston and £33 + 15% vat for the ring set.
Chris.
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Hi Gary, Hope the Gixer is going well, is the rear wheel an SV with straight spokes? if so are the standard spacers and 73A caliper a straight fit as ive just picked up another SP braced swinger for my track B4 and am thinking of going this way.
Ok there is more work to it than you think.Yes the wheel with the straight spokes. You will need new spacers. Get a rear disc water cut to match the diameter of the old disc. You will need to take about 6mm, if I recall,(you will have to make measurements), off your cush drive so the wheel will be centred(the whole unit is too large to be centred properly). and cut the bolts down a bit so they don't hit the swing arm. You will need to possibly change the bearings to match the axle you are going to use. Use the gsxr axle if you can. Most of this is easy to do. It's just a pain in the butt to do it all.
My bike is doing great except I can't get the cdi box to fire it. I have 3 of the bastards and none work properly. So I have them at an electronics wizard who is rebuilding them.
I have the B4 motor in this bike. The GSXR400 motor is going to be rebuilt over this winter so I have a spare and I have cdi's for that motor that are supposed to work. We'll see. If this guy does a good job with the Bandit cdi I will get him to give the GSXR CDIs the once over.
G
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Wow Gary i will stick with the 4.5inch gsxr4 wheels that run 160's at the rear, thought that the straight spoke may save a little weight and be a tad stiffer.
Are you running the B4 cdi with the B4 motor? and is the cdi off that motor as B4's from different years have different triggers on the engine and will only run with the correct trigger/cdi combination. You could also slot the holes on the pick up and you can get a couple of degree advance by moving it as far as it will go which does help things alittle.
Cheers Chris.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v14/David56/bandit%20400/P1010062-1.jpg
Found the picture showing the differences.
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Wow Gary i will stick with the 4.5inch gsxr4 wheels that run 160's at the rear, thought that the straight spoke may save a little weight and be a tad stiffer.
Are you running the B4 cdi with the B4 motor? and is the cdi off that motor as B4's from different years have different triggers on the engine and will only run with the correct trigger/cdi combination. You could also slot the holes on the pick up and you can get a couple of degree advance by moving it as far as it will go which does help things alittle.
Cheers Chris.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v14/David56/bandit%20400/P1010062-1.jpg
Found the picture showing the differences.
Hi Chris,
I have the correct part # on the CDIs for the 93. It's just that the damn things aren't giving any spark. One was intermittent. I bought one of those de-restricted ones off of ebay and it gives spark but the timing was all wrong.
Thanks for the photo. I will bank that.
I run the 165 Dunlop Slicks so I need the SV rims to get the tire profile correct. I may give those Dunlop DOT N-Tech tires a go this summer. We'll see. Get bike running 1st before I need tires.
G
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Thinking the derestricted cdi may need the trigger from the earlier bike, would be worth looking if the gsxr one is different as the firing at the wrong time is bang on wot the wrong triggers give.
We dont get the slicks in 400 class over here altho i get some used that can be lightly cut for some open day practice.
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How would one go about getting triggers? :trustme: :motorsmile:
Is the cam setup different with different tiggers?
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Hi Gary,
Was thinkin you could could take a look in the Gixer motor. In the uk plenty of people swop out there B4 motor and always say bike fires but pops and dont run, they swop the old trigger over and 9 times out of ten the bikes spot on so i'd have to say the cam timing is the same for early/late models and only the trigger/cdi timimg. Ive never had a B4 later than a 91 so have not been able to compare, Banditmax may know as he told the guy who posted the pictures to swop.
Chris.
Just had a good look at the picture and you can see that the 'T' mark is in the same place.
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the pick ups are the same but the rotor part is different there is a noticable difference
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Hi,
Anymore work on the motor gary? Ive been talking to a guy who's mate raced a gsxr in the Isle of man TT in the nineties and he thinks they ran a cbr600 camshaft! Have you ever heard of this mod before.
Jay?
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Never heard of the cbr 600 mod.
I'm waiting on a new cdi box. It's on backorder so nothing new to report. If this new cdi box doesn't make this thing run, I'll be parting the whole lot out. It's starting to get on my tits.
G
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No way!
Stay with it. Do you want me to send you one of the other triggers over to try?
Is it the B4 motor thats not running or the Gixer?
I think the cbr cam was in the gk76A as he raced the Isle of man TT in 96 on the bike.
Just building my spare B4 for the track and have picked up some mikuni tmr's to go on it. motor is ok and working on the frame at mo, fitting SV650 race seat tomorra so as to be ready for paint asap.
Chris.
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Ok So I stayed with it all.
The beast lives and is looking good. Runs rough right now but is going in later this week to get the carbs set up and will be on the track this month and raced the 1st of next. I will post photos and hopefully video of the events as they get completed.
It needs a paint job and new tires and we are a go.
On a side note, I put a bunch of money down on a TZ250 Gp racer. The guy I'm buying it from raced in the AMA Gp series and was one of a few privateers to get on the podium. It is a $100,000 bike in it's day and I'm getting it for $15,000. The front end is a factory GP OLINS right from the Factory 250 Gp team. It cost him $35,000 for it. I can't wait to get this baby going. It will be a while before I get my mitts on it. I still have lots to pay on it. But he is a friend so he is in no hurry . . . . . . I am.
G
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Nice to hear you got it going. Did you find the aftermarket cdi only runs with a certain trigger? I heard the 1993 on dont go! You guys run slick tyres, right.
Just spent the week trying to get my VVC to run right as it keeps eatin reg/rec's- 2 in a week. I got the mechanical side of the engine running sweet as a nut with a rejet- 40 pilots and 112 mains and now it pulls like a 600. Im going to get it on the dyno soon so will video it and stick it on youtube.
Good luck with the racing!!!!
Chris.
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Yep! it was trigger issues. I got the cdi and the correct trigger going. Using all 91 stuff. I had a friend of mine rebuilt a cdi and it works great. So now I'm having him fix and replace parts in all of my black boxes.
Yes we are racing slicks. I use the Dunlops. I look forward to seeing how you machine goes.
G
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G -- sweet purchase. Can't wait to hear more about it.
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Gary, what Donlpos do you use? got friend thats interested in using some but is unsure of the type as he's been told that they are for the more powwerfull gp machines. You had any problems keeping heat in them?
Chris.
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I'm using the 250gp slicks. I use tire warmers and if you run them hard it's not a problem keeping heat in them. I'd love to run the N-Techs but they don't make them in the 155 or 165. It's not just power that keeps them hot or gets them hot. Braking, accelerating and good corner speed will keep tons of heat in the Dunlop slicks. They are just great tires.
G
PS: The GSXR400 is in getting the carbs set up and then I hope to have it on the track monday. :motorsmile: