Bandit Alley

MODEL SPECIFIC => SUZUKI BANDIT 250 & 400 => Topic started by: Red01 on November 15, 2007, 12:32:29 AM

Title: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Red01 on November 15, 2007, 12:32:29 AM
Hey guys & gals,

I've been working on the site's Bandit Wiki (http://www.banditalley.net/wiki/doku.php?id=bandit_alley_wiki) and am trying to collect information to fill it up.  I've been scrounging around the net for a few days trying to dig up 250/400 info - mostly just specs at this point.  Please go take a look at what I've got up there and if you have any of the missing info, or see any errors, post up here!!
(I'm a little suspect on the differences in power figures for the 250/250V.)

 :thanks:
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Banditmax on November 15, 2007, 02:20:13 PM
400 went to 53hp after 1993
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Red01 on November 15, 2007, 02:59:41 PM
400 went to 53hp after 1993

At what rpm?

I also notice the earlier bikes had different hp/rpm for different markets, so is this 53hp world-wide, or market specific?
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Banditmax on November 15, 2007, 03:09:05 PM
I think it might have only been the jap bikes but cant be 100% 53hp at 11000rpm
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Red01 on November 16, 2007, 01:16:37 PM
Any plans / chance of uploading this content to en.wikipedia.org?

We can see about that once we get our own version "finalized."
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Red01 on November 17, 2007, 05:03:59 PM
Take another look folks - and look at some of the info for other models (especially the 1G & 2G 600 & 1200) and compare some of the details I have for those bikes and the 250/400 and see if you have anything you can add to help the smaller bikes have the level of detail I have for the bigger ones - as well as helping me fill in blanks or correct errors.

As for the 53 hp bit, did that happen WITH 1993 models, or AFTER 1993 models?
From what I could gather off a Japanese site, the 250 got knocked down to 40 hp starting in Sept. 1992.  I assume that's about when they started kicking out 1993 models.
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Banditmax on November 17, 2007, 05:08:33 PM
I think the jap law came in at the beginning of 93 restricting all 400's to 53hp. So all bikes from 93 and onwards
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Banditmax on November 17, 2007, 05:15:57 PM
400's with twin discs also had 4 piston calipers not 2 like it says in your specs, 400 spark plugs are cr8ek's or cr9ek's after 1993
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Red01 on November 17, 2007, 05:17:19 PM
I think the jap law came in at the beginning of 93 restricting all 400's to 53hp. So all bikes from 93 and onwards


Makes sense... seems that would match up with the 250 then and that's what I was thinking.
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Red01 on November 17, 2007, 05:19:16 PM
400's with twin discs also had 4 piston calipers not 2 like it says in your specs, 400 spark plugs are cr8ek's or cr9ek's after 1993

 :thanks: Made the correction!  Any idea of what brand the front & rear calipers are on both versions?
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Banditmax on November 17, 2007, 05:21:23 PM
Tokico calipers on the front for dual disc 1st gen i think the back was the same too. You want a list of pad makes/numbers for the dual discs too?
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Red01 on November 17, 2007, 05:30:18 PM
Don't need the pad info, but was trying to get brands of key parts, like suspension and brake calipers since I have that for some of the others and I'm trying to make them all to the same level of completeness.
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Banditmax on November 17, 2007, 05:44:32 PM
Denso digital ignition.
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Red01 on November 18, 2007, 01:37:36 PM
Can you guys go out and look on your bikes to see the brands of calipers?
I know on the 1200, they brand names are cast into the calipers on the front & rear.  Rears are a little more subtle than the fronts though.  I'm thinking the 250 & 400 would be similar.

Also, what spark plugs do the 400's use?

I noticed the 250's gearbox has the same ratios as the 400 after gov't restrictions were put in place, but before that, the 250 had different ratios in 5th & 6th... was the 400 like that, too, or did they always have the same top two gears?
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: tomacGTi on November 18, 2007, 02:41:48 PM
Tokico calipers, front and rear IIRC. Though the front design (single disc) is copied and used on a ton of other bikes. My friend's wife's Buell Blast has the same sliding caliper.

91-92 CR8EK
93 CR9EK

Ratios: ask Jay...
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Red01 on November 18, 2007, 03:50:54 PM
91-92 CR8EK
93 CR9EK

89-90 use the same as 91-92?

Quote
Ratios: ask Jay...

I'm hoping he'll pipe in!!  :bandit:
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Banditmax on November 18, 2007, 04:57:53 PM
yeh they 89-90 use the same
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: sukizuki on November 18, 2007, 09:21:23 PM
Quote
SUZUKI
Bandit1200, GSX1000R, Hayabusa, GSX750, GSX750 Katana, GSXR750 Slingshot, GSXR1100L, GSXR1100M, GSXR1100N, GSXR1100 Slingshot, GSXR600 (2001 model), GSXR750WR, RF900R, RGV250, RGV250M, TL1000R, TL1000S, Bandit 400 (twin discs model, all years), GSXR750 SRAD (95-99), GSXR600 (96-2000)

all use the same callipers, these all fit too...

Quote
KAWASAKI
ZX6R (2000 onwards), ZX7R, ZX9R (96 onwards), ZX12R, ZRX1100
TRIUMPH
Daytona 595, 505, Trophy
YAMAHA
FZR750R, OW01
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Red01 on November 18, 2007, 10:20:01 PM
Quote
SUZUKI
Bandit1200, GSX1000R, Hayabusa, GSX750, GSX750 Katana, GSXR750 Slingshot, GSXR1100L, GSXR1100M, GSXR1100N, GSXR1100 Slingshot, GSXR600 (2001 model), GSXR750WR, RF900R, RGV250, RGV250M, TL1000R, TL1000S, Bandit 400 (twin discs model, all years), GSXR750 SRAD (95-99), GSXR600 (96-2000)

all use the same callipers, these all fit too...

Quote
KAWASAKI
ZX6R (2000 onwards), ZX7R, ZX9R (96 onwards), ZX12R, ZRX1100
TRIUMPH
Daytona 595, 505, Trophy
YAMAHA
FZR750R, OW01

That looks more like an interchange list.  Just a quick look tells me that list is full of holes!

GSF1200's use Nissin 4-pot calipers for the 1G, Tokico 6-pots for the 2G, Tokico 4 pots for the 3G.
GSX-R1000's use the same Tokico 6-pots as the B12 - until they went to radial calipers.
Hayabusas are the same as the GSX-R1000. 6-pot Tokicos until the new '08 with radials.
GSX750 (I assume you are taking about the Bandit's close cousin, the Inazuma) uses the same Nissin calipers as the 1G B12.
GSX750F Katana, I'm not 100% sure on this one, but I thought they used the same brakes as the GSX600F, which uses the same two piston calipers as the B6.If that's right, they don't interchange with the rest of these bikes, but if they use the 4-pot Nissins, they will.
GSX-R750 Slingshot & GSX-R1100L, M, N (which are Slingshots) uses the same 4-piston calipers as the 1G B12. (The GSX-R1100P and on use the same 6-pots as the 2G B12.)
GSX-R600's from at least 1997-2003 use 6-pot Tokicos.  2004 got radial 4-pots and early 90's versions used the 4-pot Nissins like the 1G B12. I'm not sure what the 1996 model used, probably one or the other of these.
GSX-R750WR uses 6-pot Tokicos.
RF900 uses the 4-pot Nissins like the 1G B12.
RGV250 uses 4-pot Tokicos. I don't know if these interchange for sure or not.
TL1000S & TL1000R use 6-pot Tokicos.
GSXR750 SRAD uses Tokico 6-pots.
And if I'm to believe what's been posted earlier, the GSF400 twin disc models use 4-pot Tokicos.

IIRC, all the Kawis you list use 6-pot Tokicos. I'm not sure about the Triumphs & Yamahas and I'm too lazy to go search them out.

I do know the 6-pot Tokicos used on all the above Suzukis (and Kawasakis) will bolt up in place of the 4-pot Nissins on the 1G B12.  You just have to be sure to use the Tokico banjo bolts because Nissin & Tokico use a different thread pitch.
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: sukizuki on November 18, 2007, 10:51:54 PM
Quote
SUZUKI
Bandit1200, GSX1000R, Hayabusa, GSX750, GSX750 Katana, GSXR750 Slingshot, GSXR1100L, GSXR1100M, GSXR1100N, GSXR1100 Slingshot, GSXR600 (2001 model), GSXR750WR, RF900R, RGV250, RGV250M, TL1000R, TL1000S, Bandit 400 (twin discs model, all years), GSXR750 SRAD (95-99), GSXR600 (96-2000)

all use the same callipers, these all fit too...

Quote
KAWASAKI
ZX6R (2000 onwards), ZX7R, ZX9R (96 onwards), ZX12R, ZRX1100
TRIUMPH
Daytona 595, 505, Trophy
YAMAHA
FZR750R, OW01

That looks more like an interchange list.  Just a quick look tells me that list is full of holes!

GSF1200's use Nissin 4-pot calipers for the 1G, Tokico 6-pots for the 2G, Tokico 4 pots for the 3G.
GSX-R1000's use the same Tokico 6-pots as the B12 - until they went to radial calipers.
Hayabusas are the same as the GSX-R1000. 6-pot Tokicos until the new '08 with radials.
GSX750 (I assume you are taking about the Bandit's close cousin, the Inazuma) uses the same Nissin calipers as the 1G B12.
GSX750F Katana, I'm not 100% sure on this one, but I thought they used the same brakes as the GSX600F, which uses the same two piston calipers as the B6.If that's right, they don't interchange with the rest of these bikes, but if they use the 4-pot Nissins, they will.
GSX-R750 Slingshot & GSX-R1100L, M, N (which are Slingshots) uses the same 4-piston calipers as the 1G B12. (The GSX-R1100P and on use the same 6-pots as the 2G B12.)
GSX-R600's from at least 1997-2003 use 6-pot Tokicos.  2004 got radial 4-pots and early 90's versions used the 4-pot Nissins like the 1G B12. I'm not sure what the 1996 model used, probably one or the other of these.
GSX-R750WR uses 6-pot Tokicos.
RF900 uses the 4-pot Nissins like the 1G B12.
RGV250 uses 4-pot Tokicos. I don't know if these interchange for sure or not.
TL1000S & TL1000R use 6-pot Tokicos.
GSXR750 SRAD uses Tokico 6-pots.
And if I'm to believe what's been posted earlier, the GSF400 twin disc models use 4-pot Tokicos.

IIRC, all the Kawis you list use 6-pot Tokicos. I'm not sure about the Triumphs & Yamahas and I'm too lazy to go search them out.

I do know the 6-pot Tokicos used on all the above Suzukis (and Kawasakis) will bolt up in place of the 4-pot Nissins on the 1G B12.  You just have to be sure to use the Tokico banjo bolts because Nissin & Tokico use a different thread pitch.


you're right it's an interchange list, thought it was handy info, 400 uses 4-piston Tokicos, sorry  :grin: It's late and I can't sleep.

http://oldskoolsuzuki.info/  is the site that list came from btw
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: gsxr400 racer on November 19, 2007, 03:25:36 PM
:shock: WOW!! :shock:
This thread blew up, valuable info going on here! :congrats: Keep it up. :beers:
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Red01 on November 19, 2007, 09:40:29 PM
:shock: WOW!! :shock:
This thread blew up, valuable info going on here! :congrats: Keep it up. :beers:

We're still waiting for you to cough up some info, Jay - like can you answer the gear ratio Q?
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: gsxr400 racer on November 20, 2007, 08:33:24 AM
I may have some time to get it during thanksgiving break I can tell you this they all benefit from using the cr8ek instead of the 9's as the bike run better with a hotter plug or a hotter stat. If you have carb issues that are eating plugs use c8e's till you get it solved then switch back to the more expensive one.
cheers
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: diesel on September 22, 2008, 12:07:59 PM
Hi

First post here, as I'm hopefully picking up an 89 400 Bandit on Wednesday to add to my bike garage  :grin: Twelve years after my last one was stolen.

I owned a blue/silver 1991 (H reg) 400 Limited in the mid 90s and its model number was GSF400Z, which was followed by the maroony/black version a little later. Both were non-VVT models. You don't seem to have these listed. Always fancied one in purple\silver, but I read a while back that it was only a prototype colour scheme - which explains why I never found one!
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Red01 on September 22, 2008, 12:39:52 PM
 :thanks: Added the non-VVT Limited for the '91 model year.
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: diesel on September 24, 2008, 09:16:01 AM
:thanks: Added the non-VVT Limited for the '91 model year.

Cool.

Model number's wrong though - the Limited was a GSF400Z not M.
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Red01 on September 24, 2008, 12:59:07 PM
"M" is what all '91 Suzukis are.  I didn't include the "Z" because the "Z" isn't included in the other years of Limited I have listed and the source I used for all the others didn't give the Limited any additional character.
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: diesel on September 25, 2008, 05:53:49 AM
"M" is what all '91 Suzukis are.  I didn't include the "Z" because the "Z" isn't included in the other years of Limited I have listed and the source I used for all the others didn't give the Limited any additional character.

Not wanting to argue, but your source is wrong - or at least incomplete  :wink: Not all 91 Bandits were M - only the nakeds. My Jap Import Limited was a Z - there was no M in the model number at all. It was listed as GSF400Z on the sticker on the frame! I can confirm this 100%. Do a google search for GSF400Z and you will find a lot of results to confirm this.

Picked up my standard 400 last night and in sorting insurance I notice that even they list GSF400Z there. I've printscreened the list my insurers give here (UK bikes unless listed as Grey Import): www.wickedlemon.co.uk/bandits.jpg

Hope the info helps.
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: diesel on September 25, 2008, 10:20:09 AM
This site looks pretty useful:

http://74.125.93.104/translate_c?hl=en&langpair=ja|en&u=http://www.bands.ne.jp/faq/faq-yr-400.html&usg=ALkJrhjZf4zTXYiWnhfzFVJbkrHB694AaA
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Red01 on September 27, 2008, 01:00:02 PM
"M" is what all '91 Suzukis are.  I didn't include the "Z" because the "Z" isn't included in the other years of Limited I have listed and the source I used for all the others didn't give the Limited any additional character.

Not wanting to argue, but your source is wrong - or at least incomplete  :wink: Not all 91 Bandits were M - only the nakeds. My Jap Import Limited was a Z - there was no M in the model number at all. It was listed as GSF400Z on the sticker on the frame! I can confirm this 100%. Do a google search for GSF400Z and you will find a lot of results to confirm this.

In 1976, they started with "A" and ran thru the alphabet through the 2000 model year with "Y".  In 2001, they changed to "K1" and have followed numerically (K2, K3, K4...) ever since.  Prior to 1976, the model year ID is a little more hap-hazard.

IIRC, the JDM versions may not use the model year codes on their VIN plates or their paperwork, but Suzuki does use model year codes and "M" is the code for all 1991 models. In North America, this identifier IS on the VIN plate.
 
Here's the page for the 1991 model year from my source:
http://www.suzukicycles.org/1990-1999/1991a.shtml
I think you'll find http://www.suzukicycles.org a pretty cool source.  While it's not a complete resource, it is the best one I've found for Suzuki's motorcycles.

Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: diesel on September 29, 2008, 05:35:03 AM
OK, so your WIKI is American only? Can you mention this on it, as it's very misleading for Bandit owners in other countries. I'm from the UK so really don't care too much about the US model history, as opposed to the global history. Especially since a lot of Bandits (Ltd edition included) were only ever Jap models. If you're only going to list US models then you need to remove the imports.

Considering Suzuki is a Japanese company and that the majority of Bandits are Jap imports it seems a bit odd to exclude Japanese models. Listing Japanese only motorcycles and giving them serial numbers that they 'may' have had,  they been released in other countries is just bizarre.

The 91 Ltd is a Jap only model, it's serial number was GSF400Z. They're the facts. Anything else relating to this bike in your WIKI is wrong and shouldn't be there.
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Red01 on September 29, 2008, 04:16:21 PM
No, the WIKI isn't American only - if it was, it wouldn't include the B4 Limited, the twin disc B4's, the 2nd generation B4's, any of the 250's, any naked B6, the 2004 B6, 2005-2006 650 air-oil cooled model, naked B12's other than 2001-2003, or the 2006 B12. 

Like I said, EU uses the model year codes, too (and perhaps other world markets?)... my info source happened to use the letter codes for all Suzukis, regardless of whether this was officially used in every market or not.  You may (or may not) find the model year code info handy should you need parts from a non JDM bike to support yours.  I did go ahead and add the "Z" to the 250 & 400 Limiteds based on your input.

 :thanks:
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Guido_Brasletti on November 02, 2009, 04:00:08 PM
Also the limited edition Bandit gets preload adjustment in the forks and also adjustable shock (same as the RGV250 shock?) and not only rear spring pre-load
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Bruce on July 06, 2011, 06:20:57 PM
Thanks to wantone and Waruta we have some info for the 1st generation B4s.
   GSF 400 Bandit 1989-1991
[GK75A]

Battery: YTX9-BS
 
Tappet Opening/Gap: IN0.10~0.15mm, EX0.15~0.20mm
 
Front Fork Oil Volume: 545cc

Oil Level: 109mm

Main Jet: #100

Sprocket: #32.5

Plug: CR8EK
 
Chain: 525-114

The larger fork oil volume is because the forks are the longer adjustable preload ones like the some of the Limited models. I needed this info myself and am therefore extremely grateful for it, thanks guys. :thanks:
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: canyonbreeze on July 08, 2011, 06:39:34 PM
"Sprocket: #32.5"

Shouldn't that be "Pilot Jet: #32.5" ?
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Bruce on July 09, 2011, 09:42:15 AM
canyonbreeze, I think you're right there it should be pilot jet. Same size as UK spec in my manual. Sprocket would be number of teeth, surely? I'm hoping ChrisH will upload the Japanese manual. :grin:
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: Squishy on October 09, 2011, 06:23:13 PM
Not sure if this is still used/updated but my 92 GSF400 has a 16L tank including a 3.5liter reserve, not 1.5liter
Title: Re: Help needed from 250/400 owners
Post by: banditv on February 22, 2012, 01:09:01 AM
the gj77a ( 250v ) uses tokico 2 piston caliper and single piston rear. 310 mm front rotor.
and i did read somewhere that after 95 the japanese govt through out the 40 hp limit and they went back to bout 45hp.