Bandit Alley
MODEL SPECIFIC => SUZUKI BANDIT 600 thru 1200 - AIR/OIL COOLED TECHNICAL => Topic started by: GP on January 08, 2008, 01:27:42 PM
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Have any of you found an answer to fixing the horrible rear brakes on the 1200 bandit?... My other bike is a Honda PC 800 ..( think 3/4 size Goldwing) ..rear drum ..and with rear brakes only it will stop twice as fast as the Bandit ....I know I know..you use front brake only ...me too ....most of the time , but for parking lot speeds a rear brake stabilizes the bike when braking ...an sometimes I just want them both ( Heck the fronts are good enogh to do a stoppie, don't ask me how I know :duh:)
So, better pads??? bettter Master cylinder ? what is the answer??
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Firstly get soft pads.Really soft.
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You can pick up a Galfer s/s braided rear line for $40 on Ebay, and get EBC HH pads for under $30.
That's what I did, and it made the rear much more responsive.
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Just the SS line in the back will help a lot.
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Just the SS line in the back will help a lot.
Do they come with sintered pads now? I used em on the 98 with no prob, and made a huge diff! lasted much longer too. :?:
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Have any of you found an answer to fixing the horrible rear brakes on the 1200 bandit?... My other bike is a Honda PC 800 ..( think 3/4 size Goldwing) ..rear drum ..and with rear brakes only it will stop twice as fast as the Bandit ....I know I know..you use front brake only ...me too ....most of the time , but for parking lot speeds a rear brake stabilizes the bike when braking ...an sometimes I just want them both ( Heck the fronts are good enogh to do a stoppie, don't ask me how I know :duh:)
So, better pads??? bettter Master cylinder ? what is the answer??
I never use the rear brake at parking lot speeds also you really do not want a rear brake that will lock up. I would recommend like everyone else though going to the braided steel line and maybe the next step down from HH for rear a rear pad.
I use HH on the front and a Black pad on the rear, along with braided steel lines front and rear. If you want I can get you a price on what ever setup you want.
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I just use the front. Plenty of stopping power up there, especially with HH pads and SS lines.
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I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH MY REAR BRAKES.....
LAST SEASON I NOTICED THAT MY PADS WERE DUE TO BE REPLACED.....
SO.....I REPLACED ALL OF THE BRAKE PADS WITH THE FERODO SINTERED PADS.....
AS WELL AS THE BRAKE AND CLUTCH LINES WITH S.S. LINES AND ALSO REPLACED THE FLUID.....
I CHECKED MY ROTORS AND THE FRONT SEEMED TO BE REASONABLY SMOOTH.....THE REAR HAD A SLIGHT GROVE IN IT.....
AFTER ABOUT 3 WEEKS OF RIDING MY REAR BRAKES STARTED TO MOAN WHEN I APPLIED THE BRAKES.....
SO AFTER CHECKING THEM AND TRYING SEVERAL THINGS TO STOP THE MOANING.....I DECIDED TO REPLACE THE ROTOR AND TO AGAIN REPLACE THE REAR PADS WITH A SET OF FERODO PADS.....
AGAIN.....AFTER ABOUT 2/3 WEEKS OF RIDING THE REAR BRAKES STARTED TO MOAN AGAIN.....
AT THAT POINT.....I JUST DECIDED TO LIVE WITH IT FOR THE SEASON.....NOW IT IS A NEW SEASON AND THE REAR BRAKES ARE STILL MOANING.....
I NOTICED THAT THE (REPLACEMENT) ROTOR HAS SEVERAL GROVES IN IT NOW.....
ANY SUGGESTIONS ON HOW TO PERMANENTLY SOLVE THIS PROBLEM WOULD BE HELPFUL.....
THANKS.....
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I would recommend changing to Galfer pads and rotors next time. I feel that is a better pad and rotor, that is why I use them.
Also recommend maybe a little more bedding in time, you might be glazing the pads.
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AFTER ABOUT 3 WEEKS OF RIDING MY REAR BRAKES STARTED TO MOAN WHEN I APPLIED THE BRAKES.....
Try putting some AGS Sil-Glyde Brake lubricant on the backs of the pads. Works like magic.
http://www.agscompany.com/products.php?line=6 (http://www.agscompany.com/products.php?line=6)
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I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH MY REAR BRAKES.....
LAST SEASON I NOTICED THAT MY PADS WERE DUE TO BE REPLACED.....
SO.....I REPLACED ALL OF THE BRAKE PADS WITH THE FERODO SINTERED PADS.....
AS WELL AS THE BRAKE AND CLUTCH LINES WITH S.S. LINES AND ALSO REPLACED THE FLUID.....
I CHECKED MY ROTORS AND THE FRONT SEEMED TO BE REASONABLY SMOOTH.....THE REAR HAD A SLIGHT GROVE IN IT.....
AFTER ABOUT 3 WEEKS OF RIDING MY REAR BRAKES STARTED TO MOAN WHEN I APPLIED THE BRAKES.....
SO AFTER CHECKING THEM AND TRYING SEVERAL THINGS TO STOP THE MOANING.....I DECIDED TO REPLACE THE ROTOR AND TO AGAIN REPLACE THE REAR PADS WITH A SET OF FERODO PADS.....
AGAIN.....AFTER ABOUT 2/3 WEEKS OF RIDING THE REAR BRAKES STARTED TO MOAN AGAIN.....
AT THAT POINT.....I JUST DECIDED TO LIVE WITH IT FOR THE SEASON.....NOW IT IS A NEW SEASON AND THE REAR BRAKES ARE STILL MOANING.....
I NOTICED THAT THE (REPLACEMENT) ROTOR HAS SEVERAL GROVES IN IT NOW.....
ANY SUGGESTIONS ON HOW TO PERMANENTLY SOLVE THIS PROBLEM WOULD BE HELPFUL.....
THANKS.....
On my 98 Bandit it was taboo to use the sinterd or so I heard! Now I have this Bandit 1299 on steroids and it uses the same rotor! same caliper, Same Pads as just about all zuk sport bikes. Sintered OEM installed. 23K miles and still going strong! Pads are half worn! Fronts are not even close to the worn out groove! The bandit would eat em every other rear tire. Same Pad?
(http://www.extremebusa.com/extreme/attachment.php?attachmentid=12551&stc=1&d=1204400156)
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AFTER ABOUT 3 WEEKS OF RIDING MY REAR BRAKES STARTED TO MOAN WHEN I APPLIED THE BRAKES.....
Try putting some AGS Sil-Glyde Brake lubricant on the backs of the pads. Works like magic.
http://www.agscompany.com/products.php?line=6 (http://www.agscompany.com/products.php?line=6)
THANKS.....BUT WE TRIED THAT TWICE.....
I would recommend changing to Galfer pads and rotors next time. I feel that is a better pad and rotor, that is why I use them.
Also recommend maybe a little more bedding in time, you might be glazing the pads.
USING DIFFERENT PADS AND CHANGING THE ROTOR AGAIN.....IS EXACTLY WHAT I WAS CONSIDERING.....
I WAS VERY CAREFUL TO RIDE A FEW MILES AND LET THEM COOL DOWN AND RIDE A FEW MORE MILES AND LET THEM COOL DOWN SEVERAL TIMES WHEN I CHANGED THEM THE LAST TIME.....
IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE THAT I SHOULD DO?....
THANKS.....
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With all you've tried... it sounds like a caliper rebuild is in order at this point.
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Accordign to most manufactures, it take about 100 miles to bed in a set of brakes. But racers do this in just a few laps. Here is some things that you might want to consider:
1. How old is the current brake fluid or when was it last changed?
2. Are you sure there is no air in the system?
3. Are you sure there is no moisture in the system?
Any of the conditions listed above can cause the brakes to drag when they get hot. This is because if there is air or water in the system it will expand as they get hot and force the brake pads on to the rotor. It is recommended that brake fluid be changed on motorcycles at least a once a year or more depending on how much you ride and conditions you ride in.
So if you are unsure to any of the answers above, I would recommend replacing the brake fluid.
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With all you've tried... it sounds like a caliper rebuild is in order at this point.
I'VE NEVER DONE A MOTORCYCLE CALIPER REBUILD.....ARE THEY DIFFICULT?....
Accordign to most manufactures, it take about 100 miles to bed in a set of brakes. But racers do this in just a few laps. Here is some things that you might want to consider:
1. How old is the current brake fluid or when was it last changed?
2. Are you sure there is no air in the system?
3. Are you sure there is no moisture in the system?
Any of the conditions listed above can cause the brakes to drag when they get hot. This is because if there is air or water in the system it will expand as they get hot and force the brake pads on to the rotor. It is recommended that brake fluid be changed on motorcycles at least a once a year or more depending on how much you ride and conditions you ride in.
So if you are unsure to any of the answers above, I would recommend replacing the brake fluid.
I AM REASONABLY SURE THAT THERE IS NO AIR OR MOISTURE IN THE SYSTEM.....
THE FLUID AND THE BRAKE LINES WERE CHANGED AT THE TIME THAT THE PADS WERE CHANGED.....I WILL BE CHANGING THE BRAKE AND CLUTCH FLUIDS IN A COUPLE OF DAYS JUST AS A MATTER OF MAINTENANCE.....
THANKS.....
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The only way air / moisture etc could apply the pads is if the return port to the reservoir won't open! which is like riding the brake pedal, or the rod from pedal to master is misadjusted holding fluid in the line and caliper. Air and or boiling water will make for spongy! or no brakes at all. Have you tried turning the wheel to check for brake drag? If you get em hot and the wheel turns with very little drag the caliper isn't in need of a rebuild. Make sure pads are centering on application, Bleed, and make sure the parts are together rite.
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The only way air / moisture etc could apply the pads is if the return port to the reservoir won't open! which is like riding the brake pedal, or the rod from pedal to master is misadjusted holding fluid in the line and caliper. Air and or boiling water will make for spongy! or no brakes at all. Have you tried turning the wheel to check for brake drag? If you get em hot and the wheel turns with very little drag the caliper isn't in need of a rebuild. Make sure pads are centering on application, Bleed, and make sure the parts are together rite.
GOOD ADVICE.....
I DID CHECK FOR BRAKE DRAG AT THE TIME THAT I INSTALLED THE FIRST AND SECOND SET OF PADS.....
WHEN IT GAVE ME TROUBLE THE FIRST TIME I THOUGHT THAT IT MIGHT BE DRAGGING.....BUT IT WAS NOT.....
I WILL CHECK IT AGAIN OVER THE WEEKEND.....
SINCE THE ROTOR NOW HAS GROVES IN IT.....I WILL ORDER A NEW SET OF PADS AND A ROTOR.....AND WHEN I GET THE NEW PADS AND THE ROTOR.....I WILL MAKE SURE TO DOUBLE CHECK EVERYTHING.....
THANKS.....
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The only way air / moisture etc could apply the pads is if the return port to the reservoir won't open! which is like riding the brake pedal, or the rod from pedal to master is misadjusted holding fluid in the line and caliper. Air and or boiling water will make for spongy! or no brakes at all. Have you tried turning the wheel to check for brake drag? If you get em hot and the wheel turns with very little drag the caliper isn't in need of a rebuild. Make sure pads are centering on application, Bleed, and make sure the parts are together rite.
I have seen where either one can do what I said, because the reservoir is for holding extra fluid so as the brakes wear you will not run out of fluid.
I have seen brake systems develop air bubbles and I have also seen systems that have moisture in them. You can tell if the brake fluid has a lot of moisture, because if you have a site glass, the fluid will be a milky color.
Since both air and water will expand more and will do this at lower heat tempratures than brake fluid, this can cause the caliper pistons to push on the brake pads and pust the pads against the rotors.
You are correct about being spongy, this is also another side affect of having air in the system. Water can cause it to, too some degree.
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The only way air / moisture etc could apply the pads is if the return port to the reservoir won't open! which is like riding the brake pedal, or the rod from pedal to master is misadjusted holding fluid in the line and caliper. Air and or boiling water will make for spongy! or no brakes at all. Have you tried turning the wheel to check for brake drag? If you get em hot and the wheel turns with very little drag the caliper isn't in need of a rebuild. Make sure pads are centering on application, Bleed, and make sure the parts are together rite.
GOOD ADVICE.....
I DID CHECK FOR BRAKE DRAG AT THE TIME THAT I INSTALLED THE FIRST AND SECOND SET OF PADS.....
WHEN IT GAVE ME TROUBLE THE FIRST TIME I THOUGHT THAT IT MIGHT BE DRAGGING.....BUT IT WAS NOT.....
I WILL CHECK IT AGAIN OVER THE WEEKEND.....
SINCE THE ROTOR NOW HAS GROVES IN IT.....I WILL ORDER A NEW SET OF PADS AND A ROTOR.....AND WHEN I GET THE NEW PADS AND THE ROTOR.....I WILL MAKE SURE TO DOUBLE CHECK EVERYTHING.....
THANKS.....
If you would like me to get you a price on a rotor and pads, please let me know. You can email me at bill@billsbikesnservice.com
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If you would like me to get you a price on a rotor and pads, please let me know. You can email me at bill@billsbikesnservice.com
SURE.....I MIGHT AS WELL COMPARE PRICES BEFORE I MAKE THE PURCHASE.....
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The only way air / moisture etc could apply the pads is if the return port to the reservoir won't open! which is like riding the brake pedal, or the rod from pedal to master is misadjusted holding fluid in the line and caliper. Air and or boiling water will make for spongy! or no brakes at all. Have you tried turning the wheel to check for brake drag? If you get em hot and the wheel turns with very little drag the caliper isn't in need of a rebuild. Make sure pads are centering on application, Bleed, and make sure the parts are together rite.
I have seen where either one can do what I said, because the reservoir is for holding extra fluid so as the brakes wear you will not run out of fluid.
I have seen brake systems develop air bubbles and I have also seen systems that have moisture in them. You can tell if the brake fluid has a lot of moisture, because if you have a site glass, the fluid will be a milky color.
Since both air and water will expand more and will do this at lower heat tempratures than brake fluid, this can cause the caliper pistons to push on the brake pads and pust the pads against the rotors.
You are correct about being spongy, this is also another side affect of having air in the system. Water can cause it to, too some degree.
Say What?? The fluid is there for the wear yes but the next time you have the capoff squeez the lever and see what fountains up! Anyway How big a grooves is in the rotors? Are they OEM? rears are like added weight anyway, why worry about a little groovey groove! Sintered will polish it up! :lol:
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The only way air / moisture etc could apply the pads is if the return port to the reservoir won't open! which is like riding the brake pedal, or the rod from pedal to master is misadjusted holding fluid in the line and caliper. Air and or boiling water will make for spongy! or no brakes at all. Have you tried turning the wheel to check for brake drag? If you get em hot and the wheel turns with very little drag the caliper isn't in need of a rebuild. Make sure pads are centering on application, Bleed, and make sure the parts are together rite.
I have seen where either one can do what I said, because the reservoir is for holding extra fluid so as the brakes wear you will not run out of fluid.
I have seen brake systems develop air bubbles and I have also seen systems that have moisture in them. You can tell if the brake fluid has a lot of moisture, because if you have a site glass, the fluid will be a milky color.
Since both air and water will expand more and will do this at lower heat tempratures than brake fluid, this can cause the caliper pistons to push on the brake pads and pust the pads against the rotors.
You are correct about being spongy, this is also another side affect of having air in the system. Water can cause it to, too some degree.
Say What?? The fluid is there for the wear yes but the next time you have the capoff squeez the lever and see what fountains up! Anyway How big a grooves is in the rotors? Are they OEM? rears are like added weight anyway, why worry about a little groovey groove! Sintered will polish it up! :lol:
What you are seeing is coming from the master cylinder piston, not the whole system. Apparently we disagree on this, so for sake of helping GETFURIOUS, I will agree to disagree with you.
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Anyway How big a grooves is in the rotors? Are they OEM? rears are like added weight anyway, why worry about a little groovey groove! Sintered will polish it up! :lol:
THE ROTOR IS O.E.M. AND THE PADS ARE FERODO.....
THE GROVES ARE NOT DEEP BUT THERE ARE THREE OF THEM....
THE WORRY IS ABOUT THE VERY ANNOYING MOANING NOISE.....
THEY STOP FINE.....BUT THEY GET ON MY NERVES.....MY BIKE SOUNDS LIKE A CITY BUS COMING TO A STOP..... :annoy:
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Anyway How big a grooves is in the rotors? Are they OEM? rears are like added weight anyway, why worry about a little groovey groove! Sintered will polish it up! :lol:
THE ROTOR IS O.E.M. AND THE PADS ARE FERODO.....
THE GROVES ARE NOT DEEP BUT THERE ARE THREE OF THEM....
THE WORRY IS ABOUT THE VERY ANNOYING MOANING NOISE.....
THEY STOP FINE.....BUT THEY GET ON MY NERVES.....MY BIKE SOUNDS LIKE A CITY BUS COMING TO A STOP..... :annoy:
Well do what you feel you need to but these folk sell as good a pad as any! and for a more than fair price! Last as long as OEM, fast shipping too! Check it out if you want here! This is close to you Westerners anyway! http://stores.brakeplanet.com/Items/es08301?&caSKU=es08301&caTitle=SUZUKI%20STREET%2099-06%20GSX%201300%20RX%20Hayabusa%20R%20Brake%20Pads
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If this is hurting anyone (sponsors) Just say shut the H up! I'll undestand! :stickpoke:
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Anyway How big a grooves is in the rotors? Are they OEM? rears are like added weight anyway, why worry about a little groovey groove! Sintered will polish it up! :lol:
THE ROTOR IS O.E.M. AND THE PADS ARE FERODO.....
THE GROVES ARE NOT DEEP BUT THERE ARE THREE OF THEM....
THE WORRY IS ABOUT THE VERY ANNOYING MOANING NOISE.....
THEY STOP FINE.....BUT THEY GET ON MY NERVES.....MY BIKE SOUNDS LIKE A CITY BUS COMING TO A STOP..... :annoy:
Well do what you feel you need to but these folk sell as good a pad as any! and for a more than fair price! Last as long as OEM, fast shipping too! Check it out if you want here! This is close to you Westerners anyway! http://stores.brakeplanet.com/Items/es08301?&caSKU=es08301&caTitle=SUZUKI%20STREET%2099-06%20GSX%201300%20RX%20Hayabusa%20R%20Brake%20Pads
I checked out the site and what they said about there brake pads.
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Anyway How big a grooves is in the rotors? Are they OEM? rears are like added weight anyway, why worry about a little groovey groove! Sintered will polish it up! :lol:
THE ROTOR IS O.E.M. AND THE PADS ARE FERODO.....
THE GROVES ARE NOT DEEP BUT THERE ARE THREE OF THEM....
THE WORRY IS ABOUT THE VERY ANNOYING MOANING NOISE.....
THEY STOP FINE.....BUT THEY GET ON MY NERVES.....MY BIKE SOUNDS LIKE A CITY BUS COMING TO A STOP..... :annoy:
Well do what you feel you need to but these folk sell as good a pad as any! and for a more than fair price! Last as long as OEM, fast shipping too! Check it out if you want here! This is close to you Westerners anyway! http://stores.brakeplanet.com/Items/es08301?&caSKU=es08301&caTitle=SUZUKI%20STREET%2099-06%20GSX%201300%20RX%20Hayabusa%20R%20Brake%20Pads
I checked out the site and what they said about there brake pads.
If you are using anything from Ferodo like HH friction material, they have material in them for racing or wave rotors that are ment to be used for race purposes! the wave rotors will clean the pads which won't last long! with street use on oem sunstars with the cooling holes! Hard material will stay on the pads which is harder than steel! Sintered will score too but evenly around the rotor. And this is all i got to say about this. :roll:
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If you are using anything from Ferodo like HH friction material, they have material in them for racing or wave rotors that are ment to be used for race purposes! the wave rotors will clean the pads which won't last long! with street use on oem sunstars with the cooling holes! Hard material will stay on the pads which is harder than steel! Sintered will score too but evenly around the rotor. And this is all i got to say about this. :roll:
I USED THE FERODO SINTERED PADS.....FDB-338P.....THE SAME PART NUMBER AS THE ONES LISTED ON DALE WALKER'S WEBSITE.....