Author Topic: Starting problem. Rrr..... click. click. click. (Read 7851 times)

stormi · « **Reply #30 on:** May 16, 2007, 06:44:09 PM »

Quote from: "Russtang"

OMG, I feel your pain there. Yesterday was the first time in months I got to ride my bandit after finally getting it to run reliably.

It never idled well since I bought it nearly 2 years ago. After it failed smog, it was carbs off/cleaning & o-rings/on/balance/off/turn air screws/on/balance/off/turn the air screws again...ad infinitum. Constantly chasing a lean condition until I finally cranked the air screws out 3 turns. Another carb balance, and it passed smog with flying colors. Idling smoothly around 1400 with no miss anymore! Snif, snif. Brought a tear to my eye.

Felt so nice to ride again! Perfect riding weather too. Highs in the low 100's

Yay! Happy day!

Hurts doesn't it? For us it's extra painful, because we wait all winter to ride, then she does things like this. Some days I just look at her, shake my head, take the helmet off and go get the keys for the Mustang.

Is there no flexy screwdriver you can get to make that corner so you don't have to take the carbs off to adjust?

(says the girl that keeps promising to sync the carbs, but usually gives up when Dita runs properly, lest I piss her off enough that she breaks something else after the sync.)

We're at about 75 today,.. and I'm loving it. :) Now that both bikes are running, I may just insist that our wednesday trip in is on the bikes, not in the car.

stormi · « **Reply #31 on:** May 17, 2007, 02:37:29 AM »

And it looked like it might rain, so we took the car in instead. Oh well.

Here's the update on the battery: spent half the afternoon working out her other gremlin (throttle cable related, causing her to race to 14K rpms at idle.), and in the process, must have started her 10 times, and not a hiccup. This is using her old battery still.

I -completely- forgot to do the drain test, but I will maybe try that tomorrow.

This evening, we took her for a quick ride, and she behaved very well (or as well as a 400 with new exhaust, but no jetting can do anyway - don't worry, she's still running rich, no seized engines in Dita's near future.)

So Dita's "short list" of things to do:
organic and steel plates in the clutch
water pump hose
carb sync
jetting

after that, I'm considering trying to get her out onto the track.

longislandbandit99 · « **Reply #32 on:** July 01, 2007, 12:17:32 PM »

I'm having the same exact problem with my bandit except I know the battery is brand new. I had an overheat issue in the beginning of May and the bike wouldn't start when I shut it down to cool off. The starter simply whirred away never linking up with the flywheel to crank the motor. I just did a carb rejetting and cleaning and tried to start the bike, nothing. Whirrrrrrrrrrrr. I can hear the starter spinning something but what I can't tell.

I'm guessing I need to break out the service manual and multimeter and begin testing relays and stuff. When the bike overheated, I did manage to get it bump started and rode it home which took an hour. So I know the motor isn't seized. The plugs look great and as far as I know this was the first time the motor overheated from sitting in traffic idling. The previous weekend I had a problem starting it too when I was low on gas and it stalled at a light. It didn't want to turn over, just clicked, whirred, and somehow did start. I guess because I was still rolling forward a bit.

I know my carbs were a bit off and kind of dirty. The shop that did the cleaning two years ago did not reassemble them properly (springs in 2 top caps all kinked and bound, pilot screws not set evenly) so that contributed to the running lean and horrendously. Could I have a bad starter too? Or a relay I fried somehow?

This Stinks!

stormi · « **Reply #33 on:** July 01, 2007, 02:06:47 PM »

Well, I'm finally going to get a chance to do that leak test that Zen mentions above today, because I'm convinced there's still something wrong here. We haven't changed the battery yet, and she starts reliably for probably 3 or so days after her battery is fully charged with a battery tender, then she starts to slow down. I do suspect the battery now, but I find her behaviour very bizarre. Luckily the other half has gotten good at bump starting her in about 10 feet flat.

As for your problem, I'd be inclined to say that you have a mechanical problem with the starter if it turns, but doesn't turn the engine. (Or the gear (I wanna say ring gear, but is that right on a bike??) it uses to engage the flywheel, hopefully not the flywheel or anything inside the engine cases) If you hear a "click" near the battery when you try to start it, the relay and the starter solenoid work. (That's the click click I was referring to in my original post)

In the manual, (or at least I assume this should be there, as it is in the B400 manual) there should be a section on testing and rebuilding the starter. There are a ton of parts inside, but it's completely doable.

Which bike do you have, BTW? B6 or B12?

longislandbandit99 · « **Reply #34 on:** July 01, 2007, 04:18:49 PM »

I have the B12. You can definitely hear and feel the starter spinning freely. I don't think the battery is the issue. I wonder if overheating could have fried something in the starter? Perhaps the weekend before the overheat there was an issue and the overheating pushed it over the edge.

**Edit**

I'm reading through the manual and it says "Engine does not turn though the starter motor runs" is a faulty starter motor clutch. That sounds fun. How much fun I guess I'm about to find out.

Red01 · « **Reply #35 on:** July 01, 2007, 04:41:06 PM »

LIB - Check the starter clutch! (The B12's equivalent to the ring gear in a car.) It's behind the left crankcase cover, which also covers the starter pinion. The most common thing is the bolt that holds it to the end of the crank (#4 below) has worked its way loose. Seems several escaped the factory without getting locktite and the proper torque.

longislandbandit99 · « **Reply #36 on:** July 01, 2007, 04:45:31 PM »

Sounds great to me. Is there a gasket I need to replace when I remove that cover? Also I keep hearing about this loktite stuff. Can I use the permatex aviation gasket stuff I use on marine engines? It is a gasket sealer, anti-corrosion applicant that is used on bolts, nuts, gaskets, etc.

Red01 · « **Reply #37 on:** July 01, 2007, 05:02:34 PM »

If you're careful, you can get the cover off with the gasket intact. If not, you can use a silicone gasket-in-a-tube.
Loctite is a thread locking fluid that you apply to threads that will cure and lock the fastener. You can find it at most auto parts stores. It comes in several strengths, the weakest one is fine. The strongest stuff will make removal VERY difficult, should you ever need to.

longislandbandit99 · « **Reply #38 on:** July 01, 2007, 06:22:19 PM »

Hopefully I don't need some of the special tools in the manual to hold things in place??

Red01 · « **Reply #39 on:** July 04, 2007, 01:53:38 PM »

Just put it in 1st gear. If the motor tries to turn the back wheel before you get it to torque, apply rear brake.

longislandbandit99 · « **Reply #40 on:** July 04, 2007, 05:28:41 PM »

It worked. The bolt was pretty much wrench loose. I did my best to tighten it to spec but I wasn't able to get it much past 75 ft-lbs. Spec is around 108 ft-lbs. I had to use a screwdriver in between the teeth of the sprocket in there to keep it from spinning. The brake lever and first gear trick didn't work. It turned over wonderfully. Better yet, it sounds great! As in great I didn't mess up the carb re-jetting. I may not have to even tinker with it much at all if any tinkering is needed. I took it on a short ride and didn't get to open it up much at all. Drizzle on the roads right now.

I'll know more tomorrow when I give it a proper testing.

Thanks to all who helped!

stormi · « **Reply #41 on:** July 04, 2007, 05:48:51 PM »

Yay! Congrats!! Happy riding!

Off to go look at some fairings myself here...