Author Topic: Hmm what to do... (Read 4660 times)

Nige · « **on:** May 13, 2005, 08:12:23 PM »

Well, you might remember me from such posts as 'New Bandit, shame it doesnt work'. Well after spending about £90 in garage and transport fees I've finally found out some information:
3 of the 4 cyclinders are not compressing properly and there is something seriously wrong caused by general engine wear.

I'm doubting its a blown HeadGasket since only 2 cylinders would be faulty (a blown headgasket in 2 places is unlikely???).
I've been told the cylinders are probably worn out and that short of changing the engine and spending a fortune there's not much I can do. The fact that he got me to sit down on a chair before he told me this kind of says it all really.
My B400 is a rare english version and is cosmetically almost perfect, it's such a great bike to ride (when it works).

So this leaves me with the following options:

-Sell it to a breakers for £80 (after buying the bike for £700)
-Breaking it up and selling the parts myself
-Fixing the problem - the garage has quoted me £200 just to find out the exact problem...then god knows how much to fix.

What do you guys think? Should I go for it and fix it up or does this sound like a no hoper??

Aah the perils of buying privately 2nd hand..

Nigel (

poking you for all your knowledge again)

Red01 · « **Reply #1 on:** May 13, 2005, 08:18:26 PM »

What do they quote you for an overhaul?

Ask Jay what he paid for his big pistons - I believe they came from your side of the pond... might as well boost the size & power if you've gotta go in...

Thief400 · « **Reply #2 on:** May 13, 2005, 08:48:27 PM »

I have to ask this, But if you don't have the know how to fix a bike, why did you buy one that wasn't running right?

Nige · « **Reply #3 on:** May 13, 2005, 09:57:46 PM »

No thats fair enough Thief400, it was running perfectly fine when i bought it and for a month after, just had an MOT done and had been 'serviced' with what i thought was all the documentation. Obviously not. I have a feeling I was duped big time. My original plan was to buy a 2nd hand bike and a Haynes manual and start from there, teaching myself as I went along, but I really wasnt expecting such a steep learning curve.
I've worked on old british 125cc bikes (pre 1970's) and have a good ammount of knowledge on the electrical side of things after training in the REME, but an inline 4 cylinder variable valve 400 cc japenese bike is a little out of my comfort zone to confidently tinker with.

I'm considering just going for it, a pack of beer in one hand, haynes manual and just stripping it down myself

might be the best choice.

For an overhaul Red01, i'm guessing £400-600. They're a large and busy garage, and considering this is almost as much as I paid for the bike, makes me shudder at the thought.

Who knows i might have some parts going up for grabs soon

It could be something as simple as worn o-rings though. Who knows at this point, just looking for some ideas. Would something like this be easy to sort with a haynes manual and half a pint of common sense?

Zhi · « **Reply #4 on:** May 13, 2005, 10:27:12 PM »

If you've got the manual, tools, a competent hand, and some patience, I'd say have at it. Worse case scenario is that you end up tearing the whole bike down and selling it piece meal. If you have a digital camera, it may come in handy when you decide to put things back together.

interfuse · « **Reply #5 on:** May 13, 2005, 10:46:23 PM »

I say go for it. You've gotta start somewhere and the B4 isn't rocket science. I've learned everything I know about engines from my little bandit. It's a great starting point.

I doubt you'll find a haynes manual for the bike. There is a PDF downlowd of the shop manual somewhere on the site.

Red01 · « **Reply #6 on:** May 14, 2005, 01:00:05 AM »

IIRC, the manual you refer to is for a US model and wouldn't cover anything peculiar to a "V" (variable valve) model.

Maniac · « **Reply #7 on:** May 14, 2005, 03:41:07 AM »

It's quite likely the problem is the rings, and not the cylinders themselves! Rings wear, it's a fact of life. Worn rings, thankfully, are easy to diagnose too!

Judging from your post I'm assuming you don't have your own compression tester? Got any friends with one? Can you get one? Should be fairly cheap... (says the guy who also doesn't own one).

Do this. First, test the compression on all 4 cylinders and write it down. The manual should tell you where they should be (range) and how much variance there should be between them.

Now, take some 10w/30 motor oil and pour about a capfull into the cylinder you are testing. Retake a compression reading. If the value goes up by a good amount, then your rings are toast. If it remains the same, or doesn't move much, then you may have a blown head gasket or valves that aren't seating properly.

Depending on if the rings are just worn or if they disintigrated, you may be able to get away with just having the cylinders honed and installing new rings/gaskets.

Red01 · « **Reply #8 on:** May 14, 2005, 02:53:59 PM »

Quote from: "Maniac"

Judging from your post I'm assuming you don't have your own compression tester? Got any friends with one? Can you get one? Should be fairly cheap... (says the guy who also doesn't own one).

The basic compression tester you're speaking of can be found at most discount auto parts stores for ~$30 and comes with the adapters for most spark plug sizes.

A leakdown compression tester is even better and will save you from doing each cylinder twice - and adding oil to the cylinder (which is nearly impossible on some engines - Like Honda CVCC autos). It can even tell you if it's intake or exhaust valves that are the problem. The drawbacks are this tool is double to triple the cost of the basic tester and requires a compressed air source to charge each cylinder.

That said, I've managed along just fine over the years with a basic one. If I was diagnosing engines for a living, I'd go for a leakdown one. Either one may be availble for rental for a small fraction of the cost though... some parts stores even offer them free.

Frankenstein · « **Reply #9 on:** May 15, 2005, 01:31:00 AM »

Go with the learning curve, the scrappers(breakers?) will maybe pay more for it already disassembled if you can't get it, and you will surely learn something. The Bandit is a really good elementary school of bike repair. I'm already in the 3rd grade. I got a gold star last month for Most Improved! You will need 5th grade to work on variable valves though. Hope it's your O-rings. Slainte!
Andrew

Nige · « **Reply #10 on:** May 15, 2005, 10:13:16 AM »

Thanks for understanding guys, I think my plan is going to be to pop down to the garage and ask them if i can:

1) use their comrpession tester (They tested the cylinders for me already and found 3 arent compressing properly)

2) ask them nicely to do it for me and write down the figures, I find it funny how if this is how you can diagnose if you have worn O-rings or a blown headgasket e.t.c that they would charge £200 for it

Thanks for helping me find the start point of what is probably going to be a long and (hopefully not) expensive road, but hey, if it does all work out, how many people can say they have a UK B400

that runs...more or less.

If any of you guys ever come to the UK, the round's on me!

Nigel