Clunky shifting B12

[China Greg]

Hmm.
Thanks, Holland.
Falling asleep last night, I was dreaming about DOING it (pulling the motor). If you are correct, what a surprise THAT could have been later.

Yeah, now that I consider, I've never heard of a "standard" (non-cassette) trans being pulled out through the pan (although I haven't seen THAT many).
I think I'd better just pray for the new shift-shaft components to improve the imprecise feeling. It's not THAT terrible a "problem" overall.. everything is engaging fully and all.... it's just kind of glitchy and annoying, encouraging me to make precise and deliberate shift moves, to be smooth.

I figure it's worth the $72 and a few hours of labor; otherwise that's just what the bike will shift like while I own it.

[Bob Holland]

One of the last bikes I worked on for someone else was a zx12 that was hard to shift. When I pulled the shift mechanism out I could see nothing wrong, but could shift the trans with ease by turning the shift drum. I replaced the shift shaft and it was good.
Hopefully that will fix yours.

[Dragbike]

Hmm.
Thanks, Holland.
Falling asleep last night, I was dreaming about DOING it (pulling the motor). If you are correct, what a surprise THAT could have been later.

Yeah, now that I consider, I've never heard of a "standard" (non-cassette) trans being pulled out through the pan (although I haven't seen THAT many).
I think I'd better just pray for the new shift-shaft components to improve the imprecise feeling. It's not THAT terrible a "problem" overall.. everything is engaging fully and all.... it's just kind of glitchy and annoying, encouraging me to make precise and deliberate shift moves, to be smooth.

I figure it's worth the $72 and a few hours of labor; otherwise that's just what the bike will shift like while I own it.

Oh yes well I do guess I should have worded my last statement better!
I bought a 1277 motor last weekend and got it out of the truck tonight and on the bench, rolled it over and yes,,,, great big ole main shaft, right in between the 2 the case halves.
I guess what I was thinking that when I opened one up it was really easy to work on. A lot easier than I expected, but I have/had been a mechanic for many years. I did not think it was a big deal. I did not need all the special tools that the manual said I did. Still foggy but I think holding the clutch basket while I took the nut off was the only thing that I had to be creative with. Anyway I did not want to get your hopes all up thinking it was a 2 hour job.
Brent

[Dragbike]

I have a question now. Does anybody knows if this is worth it or what it does? about $80.00 US
""Transmission Shift Improvement Kits

SHFT-SUZ-3

Make shifting MUCH quicker and virtually eliminate missed shifts. This is the same type of kit that Factory Pro, Honda, Kawasaki, Suzuki and Yamaha Racing has used.""

Is it just a better shift paw?
Brent

[Bob Holland]

I have seen those kits, never new what they did.
A little trick for removing the clutch nut, leave all the clutch plates in and with a impack wrench, you can hold enough pressure on the clutches, with your finger tips to get the clutch basket nut off, at least I have always been sucessful doing it this way.

[China Greg]

Good suggestion for clutch basket removal.

If you don't have air/impact wrenches, I suggest the following:

I was a B-grade shop mechanic years ago, (in three shops, over five years). One of the tricks we used was to place a flat (3/8"?) chunk of aluminum between the clutch basket gear and the primary gear. It jams between the teeth and should give you just enough to break the nut loose.
It's not the safest way... but I've used this method a number of times on my own bikes (including both Bandits).
Maybe it was why I was only a "B" mechanic! But it never seemed to have caused problems.

[China Greg]

Okay... I successfully replaced my 1st Gen B12 shift-forks and spring tonight, (as well as the shift-select drum, or pawl, or whetever it is).
It was fairly easy, if you can get the clutch basket out. After, remove the shift lever and left side sprocket cover. Clean off the zhit from the shaft with brak cleaner, and remove the little circlip (DON'T lose it).

Pull the shift-shaft right the hell through. Pry out the left side shift-shaft seal, clean out the hole, and carefully drive in a new seal.. make sure it's flush with the cases, but don't bend or distort it too much.

If you want to, (I did), you can replace the shift detent pawl assembly. Using an impact driver, remove the four screws holding the two plates over the detent drum/pawl assembly, whatever. Then hold the little steel blocks (each with a spring and pin), and pull them out. Re-assembly of these is a LITTLE tricky, but it just took me a few minutes to get it lined up with my greasy fingers.

My HAYNES manual was really clear and accurate for this job.

It looks like there was NO damage to any of the old components, (shoot!).. just a little shiny wear in the pawl teeth. Hmm... I'm HOPING that somehow I replaced something RIGHT, and it will shift smoother. Time will tell.

More later when the rest of the Spring cleanup is done.

[snofrog]

 
just waiting for the final results

[China Greg]

Results on the way... any day... annnyyy dayyyyyy...

 

[snofrog]

 

[snofrog]

 

[China Greg]

yeah, MOM... I KNOW it's time to clean my room!

Okay okay... this week. I've got to do a valve adjustment first... that's what's been holding me up... and the weather in S.E. New York hasn;t been co-operating.
SOON SOON! ... but don't expect anything dramatic: I examined the old shift-shaft and pawls and couldn't find ANY signs of distortion or damage.
The one thing I DID certify is that you CAN remove these components without splitting the cases. Shift DRUMS and FORKS.... forget it. Major surgery.

[China Greg]

Okay! Sorry for the delay..
Spring cleanup is finally accomplished,,, mostly!
The old shift shaft and pawl cylinder came out easily.. but the old ones looked FINE. Now all is re-assembled (with new parts) ... and I did a test ride tonight. Shifting is ... MAYBE a little better... but really not dramatically better. Maybe the shift to 20-50W oil helps some.
I THINK the bike may need a good carb synch,,, so more on that facet later. Maybe that is affecting the shifting.

Otherwise, the new Progressive shock is good, but initially STIFF when new... even at the softest settings.. but feels promising.