Author Topic: Bandit 1216cc Big Bore Piston Kit (Read 21117 times)

Asphalt · « **on:** December 03, 2006, 02:57:20 AM »

I know a vouple of people have put this Mod in, I was just posting this to see how it was working for them and what they had to do to install (i.e. resleeving or boring, and how long it took).

Also I know that the installation of the GSX-R 750 are a VERY nice complimetn to this mod.

With all these horses did it effect the Fule milage.

I am thinking of going to this mod, and get a good HP boost, but I also want to know if it is worth it to drop the 800 + in parts.

kedeg_97B12 · « **Reply #1 on:** December 03, 2006, 11:16:33 AM »

The pistons by themselves are a expensive way to get 5hp. That is about all you will get from 59cc and a 2pt increase in compression.
You get the most power from head work and cams combined with the piston kit.
I have about $1600 in mine.
Intake cam-$130
Full exhaust-$300 used
Pistons-$600 10.8:1
Head work and machining-$500 ($125 for jugs to be bored, rest for Serdi valve job, mild port cleanup, .020 off the head, intake manifold matching)
I assembled it myself.

Bob Holland · « **Reply #2 on:** December 04, 2006, 09:29:08 AM »

With 1216 kit, stock carbs, and gxsr cams, and Holeshot exhaust, I dynoed 145 HP at the rear wheels, that is a wee bit more than 5 horsepower. I now have the 1246 kit, and 155 RWHP. I did the work myself, and spent about what the exhaust cost. $700.00

kedeg_97B12 · « **Reply #3 on:** December 04, 2006, 10:48:55 AM »

Quote from: "BHolland"

With 1216 kit, stock carbs, and gxsr cams, and Holeshot exhaust, I dynoed 145 HP at the rear wheels, that is a wee bit more than 5 horsepower. I now have the 1246 kit, and 155 RWHP. I did the work myself, and spent about what the exhaust cost. $700.00

Ahhh, Bob the keyword being just the pistons. You didn't get no 45hp increase just from some aftermarket slugs my friend.

Unless you have 35:1 compression...

Rereading I see he mentioned cams as well.
What I meant was 10:8.1 pistons and no milling, valve job, port cleanup, full exhaust, intake matching or cams, one would probably get 5hp. It would rev a little snappier but hardly worth the cost by itself.

Bob Holland · « **Reply #4 on:** December 04, 2006, 01:01:44 PM »

The JE pistons I use normally, are 13.5 to 1 for the 1216 and 13 to 1 for the 1246 kits, but the pistons I had when I got this bike were Holeshot 1216s. If I rode much on the street, I would want, about 10.5 to 1.
Advertised compression ratios for pistons are calculated without the gaskets so a 13.5 to 1 piston is actually less, but I don't know how much

kedeg_97B12 · « **Reply #5 on:** December 04, 2006, 01:34:33 PM »

The machine shop turn around was a week. I sent them to Chicago to a shop that was recommeded because I couldn't find anyone in STL who made me feel warm and fuzzy.

The total time for tear down was 2 hours maybe.
Assembly took me slightly longer because I tore the base gasket and failed to replace a o-ring on the head gasket.It came right back apart. Maybe 4-5 hours to carefully set the jug, head, cams, valves, and carbs (my first time doing anything like this).

Asphalt · « **Reply #6 on:** December 04, 2006, 03:52:51 PM »

Do any of you use your bike for everyday use and/or long drives? I want to have a good horse kick to my bike, because I like the speed, and response. But at the same time, I don't want to sacrifice, TOO much fuel milage. I know that with big mods that there is going to be a loss in fuel milage, but on average what will I be looking at. I have between 38 to 40 MPG (depends on what gas station I punp from), is it going to drop to say 32 to 35 MPG or am I going to have to stop at a station every 50 miles on a long trip.

I have read testimonials on the horse power gain, and from 103 max power to 130 max power is a nice jump, and it would definitely put me in the league with most of my sport bike driver buddies who like to blast by.

Thank you for the stats so far, the numbers are what I am looking for in the horse power, and what kind of job I am looking at doing it myself. Just want to look at the other part.

kedeg_97B12 · « **Reply #7 on:** December 04, 2006, 04:11:18 PM »

Quote from: "Asphalt"

I don't want to sacrifice, TOO much fuel mileage. I have between 38 to 40 MPG (depends on what gas station I punp from), is it going to drop to say 32 to 35 MPG or am I going to have to stop at a station every 50 miles on a long trip.

Anyone who can follow a factory service manual can do it.
I have over 7000 miles on mine. I get close to 40mpg on the interstate at 65mph. With the 14T front sprocket (really allows the engine to spin up for the intake cam) I get 35-36.
This depends on your carb settings and state of tune.

I commute with it and in the summer mine does get hot if I get stuck in stop and go traffic. Others do not have that problem. If I ride it and cruise over 25mph for any length of time the bike will run 220-230°F (measured at the oil return line). In the heat of the summer it is 250° which is where the race shop said is the sweet spot for synthetic.

I commute 32 miles a day. Some days I don't get over 30mph. Yes the bike has handled this (300°F) but requires being a little more liberal on the oil changes.

It does not use any oil b/t changes (2000 miles) and I use premium because of the heat and with the head milled it gives me close to 11.5:1 comp ratio. Detonation is murder so I pay an extra $1.20. Stock engines don't need the extra octane.

Asphalt · « **Reply #8 on:** December 04, 2006, 06:17:36 PM »

Rock on. That just put the nail in the coffin (no pun intended)

. I am going to go ahead and pull this mod then.

Did you go with holeshots upgrade? Or did you go elsewhere for your parts?

Also I forgot to ask, and I looked for what jet kit you have. Stage 1 or stage 2. I REALLY don't want to go to the pods, too many bad calls about rain, and I drive in it frequently.

Thanks for the info, and any other advise is very welcome,I have been trying to call Dale at holeshot all day but no answer.

Next project is getting a twin exhaust custom built, but befor I go there I am going to Pull off the piston and cam mod.

kedeg_97B12 · « **Reply #9 on:** December 04, 2006, 06:27:37 PM »

I got most of my parts from Dale. I believe he said he was out til Tuesday. If you leave a message, he will get back with you.

I sent you a PM.

gdavis2265 · « **Reply #10 on:** December 05, 2006, 04:21:12 PM »

Good Post guys,
I'm definately going the 1216/cam(s) route also.
I think I will start with the piston and rings first and do the cam swap next year.

How much does Dale charge to do the head & jug machining?

kedeg_97B12 · « **Reply #11 on:** December 05, 2006, 04:37:08 PM »

Quote from: "gdavis2265"

Good Post guys,
I'm definately going the 1216/cam(s) route also.
I think I will start with the piston and rings first and do the cam swap next year.

How much does Dale charge to do the head & jug machining?

You have to remove the cams anyway so while you are in there it makes sense just swap them then ($130 for intake). You do not need to degree them if you haven't skimmed a lot of the head or if just using the stock replacement cam(s). Either Bandit or early GSX-R cams. Just drop em in and count the sprocket teeth for the timing.

Last I checked Dale has the head work listed on his site. It was $800 or so. That wasn't for block machining though. It is a good idea to recheck the valve clearances after you run it a few miles. That is a good time to swap a cam since you are already in there.

Dale also used to sell stock size 1157 pistons that were 11:1 compression. No rebore needed. Then if you wanted to upgrade to the 1216 as the bore got miles on it you could.
The higher compression is what really helps the engine.

gdavis2265 · « **Reply #12 on:** December 05, 2006, 08:39:54 PM »

Horsepower sure cost bucks, seems the piston kit is a bargain at 550 or so, compared to the headwork at $800.

Just noticed your sig line, cracking up on the 12v dewalt

Banditofdoom · « **Reply #13 on:** December 21, 2006, 11:07:58 PM »

I talked to Dale this week and he said they no longer do the 800 dollar headwork. They do a milder 500 dollar version now. I am in the process of rebuilding my '01 B12S from scratch with a few of his parts this winter including:

1216 big cc kit
Stage 2 jet kit with pod filters
GSXR intake cam
Top end oiling kit
Full high mount HS exhaust
HS street headwork
Balanced and polished crank.

I've mounted the complete front end of an '02 Busa onto the front and bought aftermarket guages to convert to nekkid. Once its together ill post up the dyno numbers. If i get 145rwhp ill be happy, but im more concerned with getting at least 90 ft/lbs of torque. we shall see i guess

gdavis2265 · « **Reply #14 on:** December 21, 2006, 11:41:29 PM »

This is great timing Banditof doom. I am literally in the process of mounting 2006 Busa forks (new, zero miles) to my B12.

Tell me about your conversion.

FYI, I'm using the stock bandit stem with the the stock Busa trees, mounting my bar clamps through the existing holes on the Busa upper tree. I was hoping to use bigger wheel bearings (25mm instead of 20mm) to use the stock Bandit wheel/rotors on the Busa axle. Maybe machine spacers for the stock bandit brakes.
Can you give me any specifics?

I've heard you might have to recess the bandit stem into the lower tree a bit deeper.

Thanks for any info.