Slip-On VS Stage 1 Jet Kit

[NomisQC]

I have a 2004 Bandit 1200s

I plan on getting a slip-on and a stage 1 jet kit eventually, but I need to do one before the other (money reasons).

Is it better to get the Slip-on and then later do the stage 1 or the bike will be too lean with the slip-on only ?

If not, would it be better to get the stage 1 and then a slip-on later on ?

Then would I need to readjust the jet kit when I change the slip-on ?

Thanks !

[Red01]

You can go either way, but if you decide to do the can first, at least shim the needles and drill out the EPA plugs and tweak the pilot screws.

[NomisQC]

You can go either way, but if you decide to do the can first, at least shim the needles and drill out the EPA plugs and tweak the pilot screws.

How would I do that...

Is there a tutorial or instructions of some sort somewhere ??

I know that the kit comes with instructions but doing that on my own...

[PaulVS]

I asked Dale Walker that very question a long time ago...

He said get the slip-on first.

[Red01]

How would I do that...

Is there a tutorial or instructions of some sort somewhere ??

I know that the kit comes with instructions but doing that on my own...

Bill "Blade" has an excellent tutorial on how to install a Holeshot Stage II kit here:

http://www.billsbikesnservice.com/stage2.htm

It will show you how to carefully drill out the EPA plugs and will show you where the needle is that you'll want to shim.

There's also good info on Fast Larry's site here (not as many pics, but covers G1 & G2 settings at various stages of tune - where Bill's tutorial just covers a G2 Stage II):

http://www.portablepct.com/fastlarry/banditfaq.htm#fuel_system

[NomisQC]

2004 Bandit 1200 and I live in Canada...
If I get this right, after adding a Slip-On I should:

1) Drill the plugs and adjust pilot screws to 2.5 to 3.0 turns out. (What is the stock setting ?)

2) Shim the needles with 0.5mm shim (0.020 inches)
 (Where can I get those in Canada, I only see posts about the nylon ones from The Source)

3) Put #110 (or #112?) main jets (Where can I order those online)

4) Float height should already be set to 13 mm, right ? So no need to adjust ?

Thanks !

[PaulVS]

2004 Bandit 1200 and I live in Canada...
If I get this right, after adding a Slip-On I should:

1) Drill the plugs and adjust pilot screws to 2.5 to 3.0 turns out. (What is the stock setting ?)

2) Shim the needles with 0.5mm shim (0.020 inches)
 (Where can I get those in Canada, I only see posts about the nylon ones from The Source)

3) Put #110 (or #112?) main jets (Where can I order those online)

4) Float height should already be set to 13 mm, right ? So no need to adjust ?

Thanks !

Yes... these 4 things will give you about 90+ % of the effectiveness of a Stage 1 jet kit.

1.  I believe the stock settings are 2.0.  You can go all the way to about 4.25 safely.  Find the adjustment that's best for your bike.

2.  Use two shims (washers) on each needle.  You can get these at Radio Shack in an assortment pack (They have a Canadian conterpart, I believe)  The Radio Shack part # is 64-3022A.  Here's a good video if you've never done it....  http://gstwins.com/video/needleshim.wmv

3.  #110 would be fine.  Can get them at www.carbparts.com

4.  You shouldn't have to touch the float height.

[Red01]

What PaulVS said, with these minor additions:

1. Stock settings can be all over the map. When I drilled my plugs off, one of the carbs had the screw almost fully seated and one was at 2.5 turns, the others were somewhere in between.

4. Do check the float height as a verification measure in case someone at Mikuni was as distracted as the one who set my pilot screws.

[NomisQC]

Thanks guys !

Radio Shack canadian's counterpart is "The Source" and they only have the shitty nylon washers...

1) Still looking for the Radio Shack equivalent in Canada or online...

Also, what about clipping the large spring in the carbs ? I have seen that in the FZ1 procedure and some people talked about it on this forum for the Bandit...

2) Do we need to clip any spring or not ?

3) What about the airbox mod, should I drill the 20 holes as per Ivan's intructions ? Where ?

4) What about the snorkel (leave it or remove it)

5) I read about people saying it runs too rich or too lean and making minor adjustments to the shims/screws... Once the mod is made, how do you know precisely if it's running too lean or too rich ?

Thanks !

[PaulVS]

You can clip the springs... but I think the difference would be negligible.  If you want to try it the general concensus seems to be about 25mm off the total length.  I think Holeshot recommends cutting in their Stage 1 kits... but Ivan's kit & Factory Pro do not

Nylon washers may be better... they won't rust.  They may, however, be thicker than the steel ones... so adjust accordingly.

I'd first run with the snorkel, and then without it... to see if there's any perceptible difference.  I doubt there will be much if any... but if it seems to run better without it... then you could begin to try to start drilling some holes, incrementally.  You want to drill them on the plane of the airbox lid that faces rearward.  I personally believe (without any physical evidence to back it up) that smaller, maybe 1/2 inch holes are better because there would be less turbulence in the airbox than with 1" or 2" holes.

Basically though... 2 shims, 110 (or 112) main jets, A/F screws out 3 turns, and just removing the snorkel (no holes drilled) seems to be the ideal setup for most 2nd Gen B12 owners with a slip-on exhaust.  I doubt that you'll be able to 'fine-tune' it much after that without really accurate dyno tests after each change.

My $.02 worth, anyway.

[pmackie]

Hey nomisqc,

If you PM me your mailing address, I'll mail you the 0.5 mm steel shims that I have left over. (Baz on this site sent them to me).

I think I only have 6 though, so not enough for 2/needle.

[NomisQC]

Thanks Pmackie...see your PMs...


So...is it 1 or 2 0.020" (.5mm) shims ?

Fast larry's website suggest one....many people talk about 2....

[Red01]

AFAIK, the spring trim only applies to Holeshot Stage II kits.

[pmackie]

Hey nomisqc

I got you PM. Shims will be in the mail tomorrow.

Maybe one of the 1200 guys will answer if it is one or two shims, but with a slip on, likely you will need two shims.

[Red01]

Depends on the bike... some do OK with one, others do better with two.