Author Topic: Kawasakit GTR1400 (Read 11716 times)

SteelD · « **Reply #30 on:** May 18, 2007, 03:52:37 AM »

Quote from: "CWO4GUNNER"

Well for those that missed it or miss it, here is a taste of the next technological leap forward in production motorcycling.
WARNING! The following video you are about to see may cause an epiphany between you and your current motorcycle, so please remain calm.
http://www.kellys-kawasaki.com/video/1400GTR-08_1_m.wmv

I wouldn't call it a leap forward myself. It's just Kawasaki's version of an FJR (that's been on the market for years now) with a slightly bigger engine and a bazooka for an exhaust pipe. What does that bike have that the FJR or BMW or Honda don't to make it a leap forward?

CWO4GUNNER · « **Reply #31 on:** May 18, 2007, 04:11:25 AM »

SteelD · « **Reply #32 on:** May 18, 2007, 07:42:01 AM »

CWO4GUNNER, you don't really believe in all that marketing stuff do you?

Let's wait and see what it will do on the roads and not what it says in the brochure.

Red01 · « **Reply #33 on:** May 18, 2007, 10:53:01 AM »

Gunner did a poor job by reciting ad jingo, the only things that mentioned was the radial mount calipers & inverted forks. (But then BMW's liter+ ST machines don't use conventional forks at all, they use either Telelever or Duolever.) The rest was all marketing hype.

The C14 does have a few things the FJR & BMW don't have:

Variable valve timing
Radial pump master cylinders for the front brakes & clutch
Keyless ignition switch (IMHO, kinda gimmicky - and could be spendy to replace if you ever loose the fob)

And somethings a BMW has, but the FJR doesn't:

>150 hp
6-speed gearbox
anti-shaft jacking linkage
Tire pressure monitoring ($260 option on the BMW)

If it's true the C14's price will be FJR-like, it'll be a tough competitor in it's niche... which is NOT the same niche as the Bandit, but many Bandit owners farkle their bikes in that direction. Many Bandit owners farkle their bikes in the hooligan bike direction, too. That's always been a beauty of the Bandit, it's a blank canvas to make it whatever you want, much like in the old days when all we got was a basic motorcycle and we tweaked them into what we wanted.

Red01 · « **Reply #34 on:** May 18, 2007, 10:56:37 AM »

Quote from: "SteelD"

Let's wait and see what it will do on the roads and not what it says in the brochure.

That's the first thing I'm waiting for - some magazine shootouts between the C14, FJR, ST13 & K12GT.

The second thing I'm waiting for is the first year models to get bought up and tested by the public to be sure there's no glaring, deal breaker, problems and if their are, how Kawi handles them.

ZenMan · « **Reply #35 on:** May 18, 2007, 11:03:24 AM »

Quote from: "SteelD"

CWO4GUNNER, you don't really believe in all that marketing stuff do you?

I think he believes anything that supports whatever infatuation he has at the time... remember his GSX-R1000 thread?

Quote from: "Red01"

Gunner did a poor job by reciting ad jingo, the only things that mentioned was the radial mount calipers & inverted forks. The rest was all marketing hype.

Well, who needs hard data when you have hype?

ZenMan · « **Reply #36 on:** May 18, 2007, 11:22:24 AM »

Quote from: "Red01"

If it's true the C14's price will be FJR-like, it'll be a tough competitor in it's niche... which is NOT the same niche as the Bandit, but many Bandit owners farkle their bikes in that direction. Many Bandit owners farkle their bikes in the hooligan bike direction, too. That's always been a beauty of the Bandit, it's a blank canvas to make it whatever you want, much like in the old days when all we got was a basic motorcycle and we tweaked them into what we wanted.

Exactly!

In my case, I'm enhancing my B1250 in the sport-touring mode... with the empathis on SPORT. I prefer the lighter and less bulky soft luggage, but with the added comfort of a variable windscreen, handguards, and probably a lower fairing.

At the same time, I want the performance and handling that the chain drive and lighter weight gives, and the power & torque the new engine has.

I can get everything I want including the bike for well under $10K, and have a motorcycle that suits me perfectly.

BTW... I noticed DW at Holeshot achieved 172mph (indicated) on his B1250 with his slip-on, TFI and K&N airbox mod. That's only about $650 bucks worth of stuff.

Whaddya figure actual true MPH is... maybe 165? Not bad.

SteelD · « **Reply #37 on:** May 18, 2007, 11:43:11 AM »

Quote from: "Red01"

The C14 does have a few things the FJR & BMW don't have:

Variable valve timing
Radial pump master cylinders for the front brakes & clutch
Keyless ignition switch (IMHO, kinda gimmicky - and could be spendy to replace if you ever loose the fob)

And somethings a BMW has, but the FJR doesn't:

>150 hp
6-speed gearbox
anti-shaft jacking linkage
Tire pressure monitoring ($260 option on the BMW)

Thanks for that Paul. Isn't VVT effectively the same as Honda's V-TEC and don't VFR riders complain that they preferred the earlier non-V-TEC bikes? I'm not sure what radial pump master cyclinders are but it's not as if the brakes on other bikes are no good right now.

The FJR has 145 hp which isn't far off 150 hp and we all know that it's how it delivers its power and torque, not so much the amount - the B1250 is a good example of that. I'm not sure what the anti-shaft jacking linkage is going to bring in real terms and keyless ignition and tyre pressure monitoring are little farkles. I wouldn't classify any of this as being the 'great leap forward'.

Take the BMW K1200GT for example. Everybody seemed to rave about this super-powerful BMW tourer when it was announced and how it was going to re-define the sport-tourer category. In side-by-side tests with the ST1300, FJR and even BMW's own R1200RT, it sometimes wins, it sometimes loses and it could be any one of the Honda, Yamaha or BMW bikes that comes out on top simply because they all turn out to have weaknesses as well as strengths and they appeal to different people for different reasons. The K1200GT simply didn't turn out to be the category defining machine it was hyped up to be.

So, I take all the marketing hype and fancy names for the 'new' innovations with a pinch of salt and wait until it is compared with its peers on the road under real conditions and the OTR price taken into account.

BTW, something the FJR has but the BMW doesn't is the clutchless version. It's not everybody's cup of tea and I expect it to be more refined in later versions but it does appeal to some.

Red01 · « **Reply #38 on:** May 18, 2007, 12:45:46 PM »

The VFR's V-TEC is different that VVT. The VFR runs on two valves until the magic rpm when the other two open up. There's multiple reasons it's not so popular. One is the sudden change in character - like an old 2-stroke coming on the pipe. Another is the added difficulty in doing valve adjustments. I hear they're a major PIA. One more is they got rid of the gear driven cams and the music they made.
(The V-TEC Honda uses in their cars is VVT, IIRC.)

Radial master cylinders are the latest rage in sport-bikes and are supposed to be more compact and effecient. I don't know how they're more effecient, I don't think there's any breakthroughs in the physics of hydraulics.

There's certainly nothing earth shattering about the indiviual features of the C14, it's just putting a bunch of them in one package. How it all works together still remains to be seen. That's one reason I'm not running down to my Kawi dealer and putting a deposit down on one (and they are accepting them - only $99 holds one, unlike the $500 Yamaha wanted). Still looks good on paper/screen though.

CWO4GUNNER · « **Reply #39 on:** May 19, 2007, 02:17:46 AM »

smooth operator · « **Reply #40 on:** May 19, 2007, 07:19:15 AM »

The consumers are always being lured by the latest in technoligy. Either new features,or more HP,more this or better that. The bike I have a itch for right now doesn't have any of that. Maybe I'll see one @ Mid OH vintage days this year.(not that I have the $ to buy right now) When I was a kid,my Dad had Triumphs. The earliest one I remember was a 500 with a lugage rack on the tank. I used to hold on to the rack when he'd take me for a ride.I loved the smell of the hot motor when he'd pull into the garage.
If I see one @ vintage days,thats for the right price,it will be tempting. It could be a project in the making.
Dan

leedogg · « **Reply #41 on:** May 20, 2007, 01:22:38 PM »

This GTR would be my ideal leap from the bandit. i sat on a FJR at the dealer while I was buying the Bandit...man they are awesome...but for 14 grand- I'll have to wait. I really didn't want to spend that kind of money to find out that a bike was a faze I was going though. If I have had the B1250 for a couple of years and I find I will be a lifetimer- the these "super tourer's" will definately be on my list!

ZenMan · « **Reply #42 on:** May 20, 2007, 02:28:37 PM »

Hell, if I ever get too old and decrepit to ride my Bandit, or too lazy to lube my chain, AND I was going to spend big bucks on a touring bike, I'd just as soon get one of these:

As long as we're posting hyped promotional blurbs:

"The new BMW R1200RT boasts optional Electronic Suspension Adjustment, giving you push-button fine-tuning for a wide range of roads, loads and moods. Cavernous storage, supreme ergonomics and optional accoutrements like heated grips, heated seats, a premium sound system and cruise control make the R 1200 RT so comfy, so easy to ride, that when you get away, you'll feel like you're getting away with something.
The R 1200 RT is a fully outfitted touring bike with royal ergonomics, on-the-fly adjustable suspension and a long list of comfort features, plus it's a downright exciting performance motorcycle. Its 110 horsepower low-center-of-gravity Boxer engine pulls smoothly and pops thrillingly, and its advanced chassis creates nimble handling usually reserved for short rides and sore shoulders. Ride as far as you want and get there with all the performance you crave with the R 1200 RT."

SteelD · « **Reply #43 on:** May 20, 2007, 03:19:55 PM »

That BM is another bike I tried and discounted. Lovely finish, lost of gadgets and good looking but the engine seemed a bit wheezy, had to be wound up to make it go and sounds like a lawn mower at high revs. It just didn't excite me. I was happy to get back on my FJR. The Bandit 1250 is the only bike that gives a similar engine response to the FJR - smooth and plenty of pull in any gear - that's why I'm buying one.

There's a world of difference between what looks good in the showroom and living with one.

ZenMan · « **Reply #44 on:** May 21, 2007, 02:16:44 AM »

Oh yeah, I agree with ya, D... the Beemer isn't near as exciting as our B1250's. I rode an '05 RT and had some of the same impressions as you.

All I'm saying is when/if I get up there in years, I might not care as much about speed and handling as I would comfort and ease of maintenance... and the R1200RT has that.

But I still have some adrenaline to use up for now, so it'll be a few years before I'm ready to settle into a 2-wheel recliner.