Author Topic: ROADBIKE on Fuel Additives  (Read 9165 times)

Offline Sven

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ROADBIKE on Fuel Additives
« on: December 22, 2005, 10:50:40 PM »
The DEC/JAN issue of ROADBIKE (Ride Metric!) has an interesting article on fuel additives (pp70-72).  Basically, fuel deposit cleaners, octane boosters, and fule lubricants are all labeled as useless products...either buy better gas, or fix what's wrong.  Over all, the fuel cleaners, like Techron (which as occasionally be recommended on these baords) are the least suspicious of these products, and they admit they sometimes do some good.
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Offline mike

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ROADBIKE on Fuel Additives
« Reply #1 on: December 23, 2005, 12:53:38 AM »
Yeah, I really only believe in the carb cleaner additives...  They do work, I've seen it.  On bikes and cages in the past, if it runs rough after sitting for a while (obviously the beginning of the dreaded gumming of carbs not used in a while syndrom)--->next time you get gas, dump a bottle of cleaner in, and watch the difference in how the rough clears up after 20 miles....  Also, for long term storage, it's really not smart to store a full tank without stabil.

As, for the gas treatments, octane boosters, lubricants and such, never been a real big user or fan...  Though, I did see a cage test where they ran the same SUV for 100 miles (same gas, same conditions, same speed, etc...) ---->one without gas treatment and one with-----> the one with got a little better gas mileage.  Some of the brands did better than others, but it really wasn't enough to get excited about.

Overall I am a believer in carb and fuel injector cleaner; justmake sure the maint end is taken care of too (like fuel filter replacement before it gets clogged, etc)..

I'm sure opinion varies, thats just my personal opinion, and only because I've seen the cleaner work for me..

 :beers:

Offline PitterB4

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ROADBIKE on Fuel Additives
« Reply #2 on: December 23, 2005, 08:37:03 AM »
Quote from: "mike"
Though, I did see a cage test where they ran the same SUV for 100 miles (same gas, same conditions, same speed, etc...) ---->one without gas treatment and one with-----> the one with got a little better gas mileage.  


Somebody's been watching too many late-night infomercials!!!   :stickpoke:

I will attest to the effectiveness of "fuel system cleaner" - even cheap stuff.  When I got to the BOSS Rally last spring, my bike was missing badly at low RPMs.  Riding in the trailer, some crap apparently got jostled in my tank and ended up blocking one of the passages in a carb.  I was not happy.  I didn't want to spend the next morning wrenching.  I wanted to ride.  Roamr or speedytriple suggested dumping some carb cleaner in my tank.  The local store had a STP or something similar.  At higher-than-recommended strength (  :shock:  ) it worked within a few miles.  The B4 ran well the rest of the trip.
Rob
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Offline mike

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ROADBIKE on Fuel Additives
« Reply #3 on: December 23, 2005, 10:31:10 AM »
:lol:   Wanna buy a tornado, Rob ?  You've seen those things they add to intakes, supposedly takes like 5 min to install, and they want like $80 for a piece of sheet metal that I could make with tin snips and a pair of pliers..  
Huge claims of power and fuel economy :shock:


The test I saw was done by a local news channel here in SC when fuel prices went crazy a couple months ago. They supposedly did identical 100 mile freeway runs using cruise control down a section of road that has no traffic (skeptical-bout the only place I've seen a freeway like that is in the Fla panhandle on I10), and filed up at the same station for each run. They claimed some gas treatments increased mpg, but not as much as the mfgr claimed.  But, who knows for sure..  I'm betting it was a couple of reporters looking for a story doing the testing, not necessarily someone specializing in setting the whole thing up and reading result details.


Anyway,I'm like you...  I know the carb cleaner works, I've never believed in any of the other fuel or oil additives.


Here's an 2 interesting articles: one by Edmunds, and the other is Federal trade commision.  Both talk about fuel economy, but I like the realistic way they explain you can save a lot more gas with your mind (fuel economy driving habits) than you can with fuel additives.

http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/autos/gasave.htm

http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/driving/articles/106842/article.html

### 1 on th list was:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

 :bigok:
Quote
#1 Aggressive Driving vs. Moderate Driving

Result: Major savings potential

The Cold Hard Facts: Up to 37 percent savings, average savings of 31 percent

Recommendation: Stop driving like a maniac.

Offline PitterB4

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ROADBIKE on Fuel Additives
« Reply #4 on: December 23, 2005, 11:00:05 AM »
Quote from: "mike"


### 1 on th list was:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

 :bigok:
Quote
#1 Aggressive Driving vs. Moderate Driving

Result: Major savings potential

The Cold Hard Facts: Up to 37 percent savings, average savings of 31 percent

Recommendation: Stop driving like a maniac.


Topic drift warning!!!!   :lol:

I know that's right!  I've always been very disappointed in the mileage I get from my little 2.0L Mazda Protege5.  I'm often down in the VERY low 20s with it.  I wring the poor little thing's neck every day, though on my maddening 100 mile round trip commute.  As a test, I backed off (as much as I could anyway) for one tank.  I was up around 25mpg.  I did just as well with my 3.2L Intrepid (~22mpg) that I didn't have to spin so hard to drive the way I want to drive.
Rob
Bikeless!
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'98 Honda F3 Track Bike - SOLD
'98 Kawi ZX-6R Street Bike - SOLD
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Offline B12Teuton

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ROADBIKE on Fuel Additives
« Reply #5 on: December 23, 2005, 11:16:14 AM »
The majority of fuel additives are for fuel injection systems and are thus useless for carbs.
Octane booster being the exception, but if you need more then 93 pump gas, you have some serious engine mods and buy race gas.

I think most of those products are crap and most modern car's owner's manuals have strict warnings against their use.
What else do you need to know.

I've got a nice bridge for sale!! :stickpoke:
Manny
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Offline pmackie

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ROADBIKE on Fuel Additives
« Reply #6 on: December 24, 2005, 05:01:50 PM »
Properly performing equipment should always work fine with standard fuels and lubricants, WITHOUT the use of additional additives. One of the big things you (& I) do NOT know is how the product you are adding will react with the fuel and/or lube you are using.

Major fuel and lube manufacturers spend a lot of time  and $ designing additive packages that allow their products to perform properly. One thing most of the majors have spent research on is the use of different detergents in gasolines to help keep injectors etc clean. Typically Premium fuels contain more of these additives, mostly so the fuel company can try to increase sales of these higher margin products. I've seen data over the years that show some slight improvement in fuel system cleanliness with products such as Shell V-Power, Chevron Techron and Esso "No Trouble" ad packs.

Of course, unusual circumstances may require the use of something different. Let me give you an example...(a real example told to me by a Mining Customer I used to call on)

Middle of the night, you are crossing the Praries, still 5 hours from home. Your vehicle breaks an oil ring and you start using oil like mad. What do you do? Well the correct answer is fix the engine, but if you are determined to run the beast anyways, how do you get the thing to get you home? This is one of the few times I might recommend a product like STP Oil Treat, or any of a number of brands of "Engine honey". Basically these products are Viscosity Index Improvers (VII), most that have high effectiveness, but short life (ie: Not Shear Stable). VII's being long chain polymers can increase the effectiveness of the oil ring and cut down oil consumption. The effect is usually short term, but it may help you home.

Another example is water in your fuel. Best bet is to drain the water. But adding a little Methyl Hydrate will help absorb the water and get it through the fuel system.

By and large there is nothing you can add to your fuel system that will increase your fuel economy. There are only so many BTU's in the fuel, and how well you can get it to burn and create heat is a function of jetting, compression, ignition and combustion chamber design. Most fuel additives are nothing more than light solvents (products such as Xylene) that at best do nothing, and at worse can cause pinging/detonation. Some will absorb some water, but unless you use a full concentration dose and leave parts to sit in it, adding it to your fuel is NOT going to clean things up. (Gasoline has a pretty hign solvency rating as measured by its KB value).

Anyway, there's my little rant for the day...Merry Christmas to all.
Paul
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Offline el_texas_bandito

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Re: ROADBIKE on Fuel Additives
« Reply #7 on: September 06, 2012, 10:25:09 PM »
back from the dead. should i use a whole bottle of carb cleaner in the tank? wanna see what kind of difference this could make on mine.
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Offline Red01

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Re: ROADBIKE on Fuel Additives
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2012, 12:07:40 PM »
Follow the instructions on the container.  If you get too heavy handed, you run the risk of making the fuel hard to ignite.
Paul
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