Author Topic: Chain Oiler Survey  (Read 31510 times)

Offline gyrogearcrunch

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Re: Chain Oiler Survey
« Reply #60 on: December 29, 2008, 01:03:20 AM »
What I wanted to convey was that the X-ring chain I have now was always that floppy since new. I forgot to mention that it has virtually NO sideplay, an indication of low wear. Also, it hasn't gotten any stiffer with age like the OEM chain eventually did. The bike likes the chain too. It seems to be livelier since I installed it.

Interesting. I have a 10 link piece of my DID X-ring chain at my desk at work (left-over from longer than spec chain). I use it as a stress reliever often (not that my job is too stressful :) ) and it's as stiff today as it was when I bought it in July 2007. What brand/model of chain are you using?

As for chain cleaning, there's very little need for that in my case. Teflon does not attract dirt and grime nearly as much as other lubricants.

BTW, the best (and only, IMO) indicator of wear is "stretch". Haynes service manual says that the distance between 1st and 21st pin on any part of the chain should not exceed 32cm. 

Granted. Chain stretch is the gold standard. I admit that my results are empirical, but here they are: 1.- I have so far (5,000 mi.) NOT had to take any slack out of the chain, and 2.- It was very dificult to get the chain off the rear sprocket when I had to get the wheel off for a tire change because the chain had no sideways flex. I had the axle and all the spacers removed, and it was still a struggle to "de-sprocket" the damn thing. The wheel was pushed as far forward as the fender and rear fork would allow.

My chain and sprockets came out of a local dealer's (RTM, Tampa, FL) catalog, and I can only recall the first letter of the name on the book: "P". I believe it contained mostly el-cheapo Oriental stuff, but the prices were low, so I went with the chain and sprockets.

Let me say up front that brand names don't impress me, especially the over-priced European ones. I mean, what we're doing on this site in the first place is loving up an Oriental bike because it's a great product at a low price! There's also a bunch of people here who like Shinko tires (South Korean) for the same reason.

I can just call it as I see it. Don't ask me why this chain seems to work so well - I've got no idea what little yellow guy may have put his heart and soul into this chain. For all I know, he may be a "Samurai Sword" kind of chain-maker. Whatever the case, I like the result.

Finally, I must question your remark about very little need to clean your chain:

[/quote]
As for chain cleaning, there's very little need for that in my case. Teflon does not attract dirt and grime nearly as much as other lubricants. [/unquote]

Reply: The factory Suzuki Manual 99500-39134-03E says on page 2-12 "Wash the chain with kerosene. If the chain tends to rust quickly, the intervals must be shortened". The manual also says (between two CAUTIONS) "After washing and drying the chain, oil it with a heavy weight motor oil" because anything but motor oil "has too great a dissolving power for this (OEM 'O-ring') chain and can damage the seals confining the grease in the bush to pin clearance".

The Suzuki manual says the same thing as the Haynes manual about chain stretch, BUT - my el-cheapo plastic General 6" dial caliper (made in Switzerland(??)) can't open far enough to measure the 12.6" length of chain specified in the manual (21 pins, page 2-11). When I measure across the C.L. of just 7 pins (3.753") and multiply by 3, I get 11.26 inches. A 530-pitch chain should measure 11.13" when new, so my chain has worn less than 0.003" per link in 5,000 miles. There's a lot more wear before it reaches 12.6" per 21 pins!  Dividing my measurement of 3.753" by 7, I get 0.536", or a pitch of 536. The wear limit is equal to a pitch of 600. Hm-mm! At that rate, I ought to get 50,000 miles from this chain. Maybe I am doing something right.
 


Offline asskickinpeanuts

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Re: Chain Oiler Survey
« Reply #61 on: August 05, 2009, 08:01:30 PM »
Better late than never.  I had a Scottoiler on my 98 B1200.  Installed at about 3500miles.  I finally had to replace the chain at about 35-40k miles.  (Wrecked that bike at about 46k).  Installed nuther Scottoiler w/remote reservoir on my 2001 B1200.  Chain had about 7k miles on it b4 the oiler.  Also, I use old engine oil in the oiler.  WTF, it's only going to be on the chain, so why not?  Works for me!
2001 Bandit 1200S
the sum intelligence of humanity is a fixed quantity.  The greater number of people, the less intelligence per person (and I resemble this remark).
If it's too loud, you're too old.

Offline gtbandit

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Re: Loobman
« Reply #62 on: February 06, 2010, 05:29:32 AM »
After about 20,000Km with the Loobman I think it's fair to say that the time and money invested was not quite worth it. Here are my most common problems:

- It was awkward and complicated to install properly, yet oiling head never stays in place for long.

- High maintenance. It requires almost more attention than any regular chain maintenance. Adjust/change the oiling tips, check/add oil, squeeze, wash all the oil that it gets coated in...

- Drips constantly. Messy - my tire is almost always oily and garage has a puddle under the bike.

My experience with the Loobman is much like Vlad's. I bought 3 and got 1 free. I put one on my KLR before a long trip and constantly had to adjust it and change oiling tips and found it to be much messier than lubing the chain with a can of chain lube. I put a second one on my V-Strom before a trip, this time taking a ridiculous amount of time installing it making sure the install was perfect. While it didn't need attention quite as often as my first install, the results were, nonetheless, the same. In both cases, I also had a problem with the bottles completely emptying once they got about half full and making a huge mess. Also, as has been mentioned, they are pretty much worthless for short trips and always seem to drip when the bike is parked. I only squeezed out a little at a time as instructed. I gave one to a friend to install on his 650 V-Strom and he had the same experience. The 4th one is still in the package. I'm not putting it on my Bandit!
Craig
'99 Black B12
'03 KLR650
'03 1000 V-Strom
'05 SV650
+ a few others

Offline LowRyter

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Re: Chain Oiler Survey
« Reply #63 on: February 06, 2010, 10:44:07 AM »
hi Craig, LTNS.  How you been doing?

 :bandit:
« Last Edit: February 07, 2010, 01:54:16 PM by LowRyter »
John L

1998 Red Suzuki GSF-1200S
1998 Red & Cream Moto Guzzi V11 EV
2001 Greenie Moto Guzzi V11 Sport

Offline Vlad

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Re: Chain Oiler Survey
« Reply #64 on: February 06, 2010, 12:41:10 PM »
Granted. Chain stretch is the gold standard.

The only way to objectively gauge the chain wear. 

Finally, I must question your remark about very little need to clean your chain:

Quote
As for chain cleaning, there's very little need for that in my case. Teflon does not attract dirt and grime nearly as much as other lubricants.

The key words there were "in my case" and I stand by that assessment. I can certainly understand the need for more/less frequent cleaning when using motor oil and/or most dedicated chain lubricants - that stuff attracts dust, sand and road debris like my grandmother's jam attracts bees. Speaking of my case, here is what it is:

Chain: D.I.D. ZVM2 (about CA$100 more expensive than the worst non-o-ring junk)

Lubrication: Exclusively Dupont Teflon Multi Purpose spray. Cheap, versatile, not messy and widely available. A 5-10 second spray, approximately once per tank of gas.

Mileage so far: 42,000Km, about one quarter on dirt/gravel roads or in pouring rain. I love to make bandit's torque work.

Stretch: Still within spec (~1mm under the limit).

Maintenance: Practically none. Washed once, after 30,000Km or so, just because I was bored.

Adjustment: After first 1,000Km and then only at rear tire changes (7-13,000Km).

Rust: None/never, even after long rides in pouring rain.

Reply: The factory Suzuki Manual 99500-39134-03E says on page 2-12 "Wash the chain with kerosene. If the chain tends to rust quickly, the intervals must be shortened". The manual also says (between two CAUTIONS) "After washing and drying the chain, oil it with a heavy weight motor oil" because anything but motor oil "has too great a dissolving power for this (OEM 'O-ring') chain and can damage the seals confining the grease in the bush to pin clearance".

That's all fine and will do the job, for those that don't know better. Dupont Teflon is safe for o-rings, it says so explicitly on the can. It does not attract dust and grime and it certainly does not allow the chain to rust. About the only recommendation from the manual that still makes sense is the use of kerosene.

Speaking of kerosene, I washed my aforementioned chain with dish washing soap after I took it off the bike a week ago. It wasn't nearly as hard to wash as my previous chain that was lubed with 80 weight oil, but would still repel water even after it was cleaned of all residue. I just hung it to dry without oiling it again and it looks and feels just as good as the piece of the same chain that was never used. BTW, I'm not going to put that chain back on the bike because I already bought a new one, but will keep it as a spare and won't hesitate to use it again if the need arises. It's good for at least another 10,000Km.

Dupont Teflon rules. Until something considerably better comes along (I can hardly imagine any property that could be improved) no chain of mine will ever see any other lubricant, period.

http://www.webbikeworld.com/t2/motorcycle-chain-lube/dupont-teflon-chain-lube.htm
 
The Suzuki manual says the same thing as the Haynes manual about chain stretch, BUT - my el-cheapo plastic General 6" dial caliper

No need for ultra-precise measurement there. A good tape measure and a sharp eye will do the job. I wouldn't take the factory/Haynes manual prescribed limit as a gospel either. For me it's more of an indicator when is the time to order new chain/sprockets and shorten the chain/sprocket inspection intervals.

Maybe I am doing something right.

You sure are. The chain is still in good shape and performs well for your bike and riding style.
Vlad lives in Toronto, Canada and rides http://bandit.xxc.cc