Author Topic: BAD dita! Stranded in St Albert (Read 11428 times)

stormi · « **Reply #15 on:** August 21, 2005, 07:38:18 PM »

Quote from: "todius"

Don't see any resistance readings after the diode checks ("D" doesn't apply to the B4). I do see resistance readings before the diode check of the stator coil windings. They are in the neighborhood of 0.5 to 2-ohms meaning the error created by a cheap meter would be next to nothin'.

Duh! Sorry,.. yeah,.. those were for the stator. for some reason I thought I'd done the same for the RR, but looking back at the test, it was the stator.

Quote from: "todius"

I don't really see anything in this flowchart that looks off ('cept maybe the diode checks from the AC side to the DC side... if all RR's are made the same (which they probably are) this would be valid, but I could see situations where there could be differences.

In general, though, I think its a really good troubleshooting guide.

And the one that I think you're referring to comes up as a "1" therefore the same as OL on this meter I believe. Which I think it would on some RRs and then others would read something over (or under 1.00V) Is it possible that those particular RRs where that test would be invalid have already been ruled out halfway down the first page?

I think if Electrex didn't want $165 their RR (plus shipping time),.. I might buy from them since they've been so darn much help. :) Unfortunately, when it comes to downtime, I've not got that much patience.

Thief400 · « **Reply #16 on:** August 21, 2005, 10:05:09 PM »

Max output is 362.5 watts using a voltage of 14.5

stormi · « **Reply #17 on:** August 21, 2005, 10:17:12 PM »

Quote from: "Thief400"

Max output is 362.5 watts using a voltage of 14.5

Thanks! Where did you find that info?

todius · « **Reply #18 on:** August 22, 2005, 12:49:05 AM »

To get an idea of what they're (you're) testing in Step C, I drew up a few quick schematics. I left out the shunting circuitry to simplify it (plus I'm not sure of the method that our reg/rect uses), but the rectifier portion should be very similar to this.

The "little triangles" represent diodes. You can think of diodes as an electrical equivalent to a check valve. It allows current to flow in one direction but not the other. It takes a certain amount of "pressure" (voltage) to open the check valve. This "pressure" is typically 0.5 to 0.7V, but it depends on the diode. The side with the line on the symbol is the "blocking side of the diode".

In the first test, they want to see if the check valve (diode) is properly preventing flow (current) from traveling backwards through the valve. They decided to check the positive terminal of the rectifier first. Current flows from the Red Lead to the Black Lead on the multimeter assuming the leads are hooked up correctly. In this scenario, the diode should block this current flow and cause a high or OL reading on the meter.

If you follow the current path in the picture below (current must flow through the lines and complete a circuit), you can see how the first test is testing the diode in reverse (preventing current flow). The fuzzy grey arrow represents the direction of current flow (or "attempted" current flow).

This is repeated for all three legs (yellow wires)... here is the next leg:

The same thing is done for the third leg though I won't post it out of redundancy.

The next check is to determine whether the check valve is "opening" properly. Current should flow from the Red lead, through the diode and into the black lead. A properly functioning diode should require about 0.5 to 0.7V to open the pathway.

Again, this is repeated for the other two yellow wires.

If everything checked out on the diodes leading to the positive terminal on the DC side, Electrex next has you check the Negative terminal on the DC side. Notice on the negative side, the diodes are facing the opposite direction in relation to the path of flow.

Putting the red lead on the negative terminal (black/wht wire) will test if the diode is "opening" properly, while putting the read lead on one of the yellow wires will test if the diode is "blocking" properly.

Sorry about all this technical boring stuff, but I hope it helps someone understand at least a portion of their charging system better.

I'm going to bed now before I injure my brain...

stormi · « **Reply #19 on:** August 22, 2005, 07:28:37 PM »

Quote from: "todius"

In this scenario, the diode should block this current flow and cause a high or OL reading on the meter.

Well,.. it looks like the old RR was in worse shape than I thought. It read 1750 ish when the new one reads 1 (or OL) here. IN theory then, you should have two that will read OL and two with readings in the .5V range? If I read that right. Both on opposite tests, ie the negative test using red wire on negative wire will read approx. the same as the positive test using the red wires on the yellow wires?

I found that terribly helpful, thank you!

And really easy to understand, possibly partly due to the fact that I went through the test 3 times today, and plan to do it once more today. ( starting to think I might be a little OCD!

)

Once to test the new RR, then once when the install was finished ( went with the CB400 one, it was available today, whereas the one for the GS500F was backordered indefinitely, and of course the B4 one is $300 plus a week away), then once more after the test ride to make sure everything was in spec. Now that she's been ridden 35kms including highway and "prolonged" high rpm, I want to test it again.

Really, chances are that I will do it a few more times over the course of the next week.

And for good measure, I picked up voltmeter to install on her somewhere, so I have a way to monitor this instead of "surprise! The battery's dead, and you're in rush hour traffic and in the middle lane with no hazard lights!"

stormi · « **Reply #20 on:** October 03, 2005, 02:09:56 AM »

Hey everybody,

I just wanted to let everyone know that the Honda RR is holding up just great. It's 6 weeks into it, and it''s showing no signs of trouble.

I might have shortened it's life a little today ( sure shortened mine) though when I just about lit Dita on fire!

I thought I'd be smart and hook a multimeter to her that I could carry on a tank bag and monitor her voltage. Well, long story short it's not a nice thing to watch smoke pouring out of the bike. Luckily the BF ripped the multimeter off the bike and stopped it from going any further. The wire was burnt all the way up to about 1/2" from the negative battery post. There doesn't seem to be any damage to the bike at all, but I think I'll stay away from wiring for a little bit.

If anyone knows of a good voltmeter and a place to mount it on the bike though, I'm open to suggestions...

PitterB4 · « **Reply #21 on:** October 03, 2005, 10:05:34 PM »

yikes!

stormi · « **Reply #22 on:** October 04, 2005, 01:58:31 AM »

Quote from: "PitterB4"

yikes!

That's pretty close to what I yelled

I suspect that I might have accidentally plugged the lead into the 10A unfused slot instead of the regular slot for testing,... so she just totally overloaded the meter, even though it was off.

stormi · « **Reply #23 on:** October 09, 2007, 02:32:23 PM »

Sorry to resurrect such an old thread, everyone.

I just wanted to say that after more than 2 years and about 10K kms, the Honda RR is still perfectly fine. This replacement was a complete success.

PitterB4 · « **Reply #24 on:** October 10, 2007, 12:34:24 AM »

Quote from: "stormi"

Sorry to resurrect such an old thread, everyone.

I just wanted to say that after more than 2 years and about 10K kms, the Honda RR is still perfectly fine. This replacement was a complete success.

That's cuz it's a Honda!

stormi · « **Reply #25 on:** October 10, 2007, 01:14:44 AM »

Quote from: "PitterB4"

That's cuz it's a Honda!

That sorta talk is like to get you lynched on a zuk site,... luckily, I happen to know the site owner has a bit of a soft spot for the Hondas.

PitterB4 · « **Reply #26 on:** October 10, 2007, 05:04:54 PM »

Quote from: "stormi"

That sorta talk is like to get you lynched on a zuk site,... luckily, I happen to know the site owner has a bit of a soft spot for the Hondas.

I knew that too so I knew I could get away with it!

Red01 · « **Reply #27 on:** October 10, 2007, 11:11:58 PM »

Hopefully, it's not a genuine Honda RR with all the troubles I read of their stock RR's going belly-up and the most inopportune moments.

I guess I can't slam Hondas too much though - now that I own one... and a Chinese copy of one.

stormi · « **Reply #28 on:** October 12, 2007, 02:13:48 AM »

Quote from: "Red01"

Hopefully, it's not a genuine Honda RR with all the troubles I read of their stock RR's going belly-up and the most inopportune moments.

I guess I can't slam Hondas too much though - now that I own one... and a Chinese copy of one.

I think all of the companies have had trouble with RRs. I learned what I did about the inter-changability on a BMW site (F650 IIRC)

Of course I can see why some of them go toes up when they're about 2" x 1", un-finned and located under the seat on some models ( notably the CBRs - no wonder my ass got so overly warm, between the heat soak from the engine to the frame and the RR right underneath the left cheek....)

I much prefer the setup on the 919. It's under the tail, but away from spray, and you can clearly see the fins by poking a head under the tail. That said, when the time comes to replace it, I don't look forward to dismantling the tail section to get it out. That's one place for sure that the Bandit excels. It's easy to get at and test, and change if need be.